Need Help Choosing a Scroll Saw

[BeerBrewer]

Now that I'm not currently working at the moment I've got more time to focus on my hobbies such as, wood working, Intarsia and beer brewing.  I'd also like to get more into scrolling and fret work as well.  The only thing really holding me back is my very old 2 speed Dremel scroll saw.  I find its either too slow or too fast, the blower doesn't work (never did), it vibrates too much and it only takes pin ended blades.  Not to mention the hole in the table top (where the blades passes thru) is rather large making it hard to accurately cut small pieces.  Other than that the saw is fine. 

 

So I'd like to buy a new saw.  I've been searching craigslist for about 2 years for a decent saw and every time I see something it's either sold or the owner wants is too much for it.  Some even ask near retail pricing!  So I've decided to buy a new saw and I had decided upon the 16" Excalibur.  Unfortunately, no one has one in stock and won't until maybe next March, but even that seems up in the air.  It has something todo with a new Chinese factory.  Since I can't afford the $900 22" Jet scroll saw or any Hedgner saw, that leaves the Dewalt 788 and Delta 60-694.  I've heard that these to saws are near identical, is that true?  I saw a really cool video how to rebuild a Dewalt 788 by Bob Brokaw and in the beginning of the video he explains the history of the saw and he states the old Delta 40-690 is a direct clone of the Dewalt 788.  Then he states the new Delta isn't like the 788, but he does not elaborate.  So does anyone know how different the Delta 60-694 is from the Dewalt 788?  I have to assume that it is since it sells for $339 on Amazon and Lowes and the Dewalt 788 sells for $489.  It just seems odd that they are same when there is such a $150 price difference   Is the Dewalt worth the extra money? 

 

In addition to Intarsia, I also do a lot of woodcarving and I often use my scroll saw to help rough in the piece, so I do tend to cut thicker wood.  I'd like to buy a saw that will last me a while, has an easy blade change mechanism, has the power to cut thicker stock, has an upper arm that lifts and that cuts accurately.  I know, a tall order!  So aside from the Delta 60-694 and the Dewalt 788, is there another scroll saw that I should consider or better still, does anyone know where I can still by an Excalibur?

 

 

Thanks and Happy Holidays!

 

BeerBrewer

Edited December 17, 2016 by BeerBrewer

[rjweb]

I just purchased the new jet saw, not sold on it yet, the blade change deal is different. Grizzly has the dewalt 788 with stand and light for 495.00, shipping about 30.00, Thx RJ

[Frank Pellow]

If it were me starting right now I would buy a Jet (or maybe even a Hedgner).  And, if necessary, I would save the money until I could purchase it. 

 

I've learned over the years that it NEVER pays to purchase an inferior tool.  It will cost more in quality, frustration, and often money to buy such a tool.

[fredfret]

Consider a RBI or Bushton Hawk They meet all your requirements except price. Craigs list/Ebay for used.

Fredfret

Wichita, ks

[MTCowpoke22]

This was recently posted to the "Intarsia Nuts" page on Facebook concerning the Excalibur Saws.

"General International is not out of Business, but they did sell the Excalibur line to King Canada under a new name of Excelsior. This machine is the exact same model as the Excalibur, but only sold in Canada. The only change is the name. the manufacturing company is exactly the same, so the tooling is as per Excalibur... Identical Machines."

 

 

This was from a gentleman in Canada. I have no idea how true it actually is, but he seemed to know his stuff. It obviously isn't sold in the states right now and he figured it would be at some point, but couldn't actually say when.

 

Since, I couldn't get an Excalibur, I went with the Jet. I haven't had it long enough to give a good review, but so far I'm liking it. Big upgrade from my old saw. I'm still getting used to changing blades on it.

[Frank Pellow]

OK, I checked and the equivalent of the EX 16 is being sold for $700 Canadian (or $525 US) at this site: https://www.kmstools.com/king-canada-excelsior-16-scroll-saw-123314

 

I don't know if they will ship to you and you might need to pay sales taxes.

 

I still think you should save up and purchase the Jet.

[hotshot]

I don't think King Canada has purchased the sole rights to the Excalibur, but perhap they have it for Canada now.  Pegas, Axminster, Carbatec also have Ex saws in stock under their own brand names.  I was hoping to see a Seyco branded saw in the States, but Seyco may not have enough volume for a "production run".

 

----------Randy

Edited December 16, 2016 by hotshot

[tomsteve]

theres a dewalt 788 in the long island CL posted Thursday for $275

[BeerBrewer]

Funny, but I already emailed about the dewalt on CL  We shall see.  I'm also looking into the Canadian Excaliburs.

[NC Scroller]

There is another SSV member here who's ID is Rolf.  That also happens to be his name.  He is involved in a fairly large scroll saw club on Long Island.  I would suggest you contact him (via PM) and see if he can point you to some used equipment.

[Lucky2]

Bob, if your only realistic choice is between the Dewalt 788 and the Delta 60-694, then I would suggest that you buy the Dewalt 788. Both saws are very similar in the way that they are built and operate, but, the Delta saw is inferior to the Dewalt saw. It is built using cheaper parts, and there's a couple of other things that are different about the saws, I just don't recall what they were. I did a very intense bit of research on these two saws, because it was when I needed a new saw. The Delta was a new saw at the time, and all of the information I found on the net about them reported that they were cheaper made. The reason for making the Delta cheaper than the Dewalt, was to be able to offer a saw at a cheaper price. They were meant to be a mid range priced saws, that the manufacturer hoped would sell in place of the other after market saws. This was reports from reputable people and magazines, there was a fair amount of info out there at that time. That's why I looked into these two saws, I thought that I might buy the new Delta. But after reading everything I could find on the two saws, I decided to buy an EX21. The Dewalt would have been my second choice, but, the tilting head on the EX is what won me over.

Len

 

 

P.S. I don't know where you got the numbers from, but, there is no 150% difference in price between the two saws. If I were to use the prices you quoted on the two saws, then there's only a 44% difference in price between the two. Which is what it should be, as they are cheaper made saws.

Edited December 17, 2016 by Lucky2

[amazingkevin]

Now that I'm not currently working at the moment I've got more time to focus on my hobbies such as, wood working, Intarsia and beer brewing.  I'd also like to get more into scrolling and fret work as well.  The only thing really holding me back is my very old 2 speed Dremel scroll saw.  I find its either too slow or too fast, the blower doesn't work (never did), it vibrates too much and it only takes pin ended blades.  Not to mention the hole in the table top (where the blades passes thru) is rather large making it hard to accurately cut small pieces.  Other than that the saw is fine. 

 

So I'd like to buy a new saw.  I've been searching craigslist for about 2 years for a decent saw and every time I see something it's either sold or the owner wants is too much for it.  Some even ask near retail pricing!  So I've decided to buy a new saw and I had decided upon the 16" Excalibur.  Unfortunately, no one has one in stock and won't until maybe next March, but even that seems up in the air.  It has something todo with a new Chinese factory.  Since I can't afford the $900 22" Jet scroll saw or any Hedgner saw, that leaves the Dewalt 788 and Delta 60-694.  I've heard that these to saws are near identical, is that true?  I saw a really cool video how to rebuild a Dewalt 788 by Bob Brokaw and in the beginning of the video he explains the history of the saw and he states the old Delta 40-690 is a direct clone of the Dewalt 788.  Then he states the new Delta isn't like the 788, but he does not elaborate.  So does anyone know how different the Delta 60-694 is from the Dewalt 788?  I have to assume that it is since it sells for $339 on Amazon and Lowes and the Dewalt 788 sells for $489.  It just seems odd that they are same when there is such a %150 price difference   Is the Dewalt worth the extra money? 

 

In addition to Intarsia, I also do a lot of woodcarving and I often use my scroll saw to help rough in the piece, so I do tend to cut thicker wood.  I'd like to buy a saw that will last me a while, has an easy blade change mechanism, has the power to cut thicker stock, has an upper arm that lifts and that cuts accurately.  I know, a tall order!  So aside from the Delta 60-694 and the Dewalt 788, is there another scroll saw that I should consider or better still, does anyone know where I can still by an Excalibur?

 

 

Thanks and Happy Holidays!

 

BeerBrewer

i own 7 dw788's ,so you know what i think of them!

[WayneMahler]

Maybe get a hold of Ray at Seyco. I know he offers some used Ex's but not sure of what his inventory is at the moment. www.seyco.com. 

[hawkeye10]

I found my EX16 at Woodcraft about two months ago. Some where out there is an EX for you but you need to be patient and be ready to act. The hard part is waiting for it to happen.

[BeerBrewer]

Sorry Len.....I made a typo, I meant to say that the Dewalt is $150 more expensive than the Delta. You've convinced me to rule out the Delta.

 

I'm going to check out the companies in Canada to see if they will ship to the USA.

[hawkeye10]

Sorry Bob I forgot to welcome you to the Village. It's a good place to hang out and learn. Like you I have been doing wood working a long time but just started scrolling about two months ago. I have ask a lot of dumb questions but they were all answered and if they thought it was dumb they kept it to them selves. There are a great bunch of ladies and guys here. I know you will like it.

[KurtP]

Well i just checked King Canada's website and the scrollsaw they have listed doesn't look like the Excalibur

 

http://www.kingcanada.com/Products.htm?CD=85&ID=34

[Frank Pellow]

That's strange Kurt because the photos of the Excelsior 21 (model XL-21/100) and 16 (model XL-16) on the KMS Tools web site and that I referred to in a link earlier in this thread do look the same as the recent Excalibur saws.

Edited December 17, 2016 by Frank Pellow

[ScollSaw Slasher]

I got a  Delta 40-690 about three months ago replacing my Hitachi. Excepting that I thought the table could have been polished better, it cuts like a bandit and I'm happy with it. Now if it falls apart in a year, I won't be as happy, so only time will tell. Sometimes we get that paralysis by analysis in tool selection. Two questions. What's your budget, and do you want to wait around for the perfect tool, or be slicing and dicing now (slasher joke). I'm a guitar player, and if I waited around for the perfect guitar, I wouldn't be as accomplished as I am at it.

[ike]

Blake is right. Get what you can afford. It sounds like anything would be an improvement to what you have now. When the weather permit I saw 4 to 8 hours per day. I have a DW 788 and It has ben a good saw I had it tuned up  about 1 1/2 years ago and it is still running good. JUST GET WHAT YOU CAN AFFORD.

[hawkeye10]

Blake is right. Get what you can afford. It sounds like anything would be an improvement to what you have now. When the weather permit I saw 4 to 8 hours per day. I have a DW 788 and It has ben a good saw I had it tuned up  about 1 1/2 years ago and it is still running good. JUST GET WHAT YOU CAN AFFORD.

Ike to some extent I disagree with you. Some of these cheap scroll saws are junk when they are new. Because they are cheap some are hard to use and a person might get discouraged trying to use them and give up on scroll sawing. I don't think you need to buy the very best saw out there but buy one that is good quality and you can enjoy.

[oldhudson]

If it were me starting right now I would buy a Jet (or maybe even a Hedgner).  And, if necessary, I would save the money until I could purchase it. 

 

I've learned over the years that it NEVER pays to purchase an inferior tool.  It will cost more in quality, frustration, and often money to buy such a tool.

 

That's my mantra Mmmmmmmmmm....      Life is too short for cheap tools!

[jerry1939]

Ike to some extent I disagree with you. Some of these cheap scroll saws are junk when they are new. Because they are cheap some are hard to use and a person might get discouraged trying to use them and give up on scroll sawing. I don't think you need to buy the very best saw out there but buy one that is good quality and you can enjoy.

 

What is great about this site is seeing the different opinions.  All are certainly well intentioned.

 

FYI:  The clock shown was sawed with a $69 Performax.  2 1/2 years later I thought it was starting to make an odd sound, so I bought another just like it.  My 2 cents worth is that a person buying a saw shouldn't deny shoes for the kids, just to be able to say "I'm the guy with the best saw on our block."  I apologize for stepping on some toes, but the costs involved with any hobby need to be kept in perspective in the grand scheme of life.

 

jerry

[hawkeye10]

What is great about this site is seeing the different opinions.  All are certainly well intentioned.

 

FYI:  The clock shown was sawed with a $69 Performax.  2 1/2 years later I thought it was starting to make an odd sound, so I bought another just like it.  My 2 cents worth is that a person buying a saw shouldn't deny shoes for the kids, just to be able to say "I'm the guy with the best saw on our block."  I apologize for stepping on some toes, but the costs involved with any hobby need to be kept in perspective in the grand scheme of life.

 

jerry

Wow Jerry that clock is something else. I am also the type of person that believes we should pay cash for our hobbies. I know a lot of people that will charge money on a credit card so they can buy a toy. In my opinion that is just plain wrong.

[Frank Pellow]

Don (Hawkeye10).  Yes indeed, pay cash, but save the cash until you can pay enough that you don't get junk.

 

Too many people nowadays think they need what they desire now and have forgotten how to save for it.

Edited December 17, 2016 by Frank Pellow