Hawk issues

[Millwab]

I’ve been experiencing an issue with my 1994 Hawk recently where I would be cutting (at only about half speed) when it would all of a sudden rev up to full speed for a second or two before returning to the set speed. Any ideas why?  Is the controller going bad? Or something with the motor? It has the old style motor/controller that Bushton doesn’t have a replacement for. Is it time to start looking for a new saw?

[rjweb]

I thought that Buston had a motor and controller replacement deal going on for the older saws, RJ

[Scrappile]

I do not see anything listed in their parts.  You should call and ask.  Hope is very nice to deal with.  Where I live, I would just for a newer used one.  They are cheap in the NW.  I got a nice 226vs for $275, and I have put about $100 more into it for upgrades and just things I wanted to add.  Actually I would look for a good use Hegner.   All said and done, Hegner is the saw for me.

[kmmcrafts]

My 1993 220VS did similar and I blew compressed air in the control box after taking the cover off it.. seemed to have fixed it for me but I do know these motors are the ones that were known for speed controller issues.. so it might be time to find a newer saw. 

[OCtoolguy]

You can also replace tge potentiometer fairly easily. Kevin did this on his saw, if I recall. Maybe it was Rockytime. Somebody did it. A $5 part. Try blowing it out first. 

[Wichman]

In addition to blowing out the circuit board. Make sure to lubricate the saw according to the owners manual and check any knife edges for wear or burrs that may catch during operation. It - might - be a small mechanical problem.

 

 

[kmmcrafts]

7 hours ago, OCtoolguy said:

You can also replace tge potentiometer fairly easily. Kevin did this on his saw, if I recall. Maybe it was Rockytime. Somebody did it. A $5 part. Try blowing it out first. 

I did that on my 226 ultra but not because it was bad, I broke the one trying to take the saw motor off to replace a bearing that was bad. &nbsp

The early saws had a different design circuit board though and I’m not sure if you can change it on those. 
 

Rockytime ended up having to replace the whole motor assembly on one of his saws but I think he also did just a pot. switch on one too. 
 

It’s a shame that Hawk no longer offers a replacement for those old saws anymore. Probably not many people was willing to pay the $375 for the new motor and controller as they sold it as a set. Probably more like $500 these days as that was 8-10 years ago.

[Millwab]

Finally got to contact Bushton and their answer was:

"Unfortunately, you would need to take your motor to someone local to have it looked at. Your saw would have an old FASCO motor, which is AC, and we only deal with the DC ones. Chances are that they just need to take it apart and clean it up well. I'm so sorry we can't help with that."

I'm admittingly disappointed in their product support.  I don't know much about small electric motors but I don't understand why they would be able to take apart and clean a DC one but not an AC one.  Not sure where to go from here.  

[OCtoolguy]

How hard could it be to do yourself?. It's nuts and bolts. Maybe a small puller. I'd sure give it a try.

[kmmcrafts]

If I had to guess, I'd say Bushton doesn't do electric motor repair anyway. I suspect that they used to send them out to the manufacture of the motor. I least that was the impression I got from talking with them years ago about my saw. 

I can understand the disappointment, but also in their defense, how many other companies support 30 year old equipment.. I mean they do support most parts for these still aside from the motor. That said, It's too bad that they don't sell a replacement DC type motor and controller setup for these.. 

[Scrappile]

Being me, I would go to YouTube and watch videos on AC motors. There are lots of them.. Then I would take the motor apart and try to fix/clean it.   What have you got to loose? 

[Millwab]

47 minutes ago, kmmcrafts said:

I can understand the disappointment, but also in their defense, how many other companies support 30 year old equipment … That said, It's too bad that they don't sell a replacement DC type motor and controller setup for these.. 

Well, I picked up a used Hegner (c.1988) a couple years back as a backup saw. Bought a quick release upgrade and a quick clamp (game changers). Only thing is it’s a single speed saw. Hoping they still support their 30+ yo equipment.  Don’t understand why the DC motor couldn’t replace the AC motor. 

[JTTHECLOCKMAN]

You would have to change the controller as well and also do not know size wise if it will fit. It is not the motor. No reason for an ac motor to do something like that. A DC motor could have bad brushes and a high spot on the commutator. I believe it is in the controller and if I were a betting man I would look for loose wires connections. I would also blow the dust out.  

[kmmcrafts]

I believe Hegner does support the parts.. they didn't make a bunch of changes through the years like Hawk did so many parts for the saws they make today will work on 30 year old saws.. 

Probably cost as much as a used variable speed Hegner but I'd bet you could upgrade the motor on the Hegner for a variable speed one.. Not sure how far you are from Michigan but I'm going to sell both my Hawks since I'm getting out of the scrolling business. 

[Scrappile]

I know very little about motors.  So I am asking, will something like this work on any AC motor?  Like the Hegner, he has, or a grinder I have?

https://www.amazon.com/120-volt-motor-speed-controller/s?k=120+volt+motor+speed+controller

Edited May 15 by Scrappile

[Millwab]

On 5/15/2025 at 2:13 PM, Scrappile said:

I know very little about motors.  So I am asking, will something like this work on any AC motor?  Like the Hegner, he has, or a grinder I have?

Paul, I looked at the specs on a couple of those. They all mentioned using with grinders but most said "Not suitable for appliances with circuit boards and capacitor electronic components" and one mentioned it could not be used with brushless motors.  I’d be surprised if my 1988 single speed SS had a circuit board but wouldn’t have the slightest idea if the motor had brushes or not. 

Edited May 17 by Millwab

[Scrappile]

I would think you could call Advance Machinery and ask them.  They have always been helpful to me.

[OCtoolguy]

If your saw is a single speed with just an on/off switch on the side, I would have to think there is no control board or circuit panel to worry about. Have you looked up under the side frame of your saw? I had one of the very early Hawks (1985) ish and it just had a switch if I recall. The speed change was via a ribbed belt. If it were me, I'd have to try taking the motor off the saw and giving it a good blowing out with your blow gun. The dust we produce with our scroll saws is so fine that it infiltrates everything. Also, you might do some checking around your area and see if there is a motor shop near you. Best of luck. Don't give up.

[OCtoolguy]

I just did some reading and youtube watching regarding AC motors. I learned some things but what I did pick up on was simple. Make sure you have good clean power at your saw. Check the power cord, take all the switches and such out of the equation. Try plugging your saw into a different outlet and maybe even on a different circuit. Once you have determined that you have good power, then you can be sure it's truly the motor that is giving you the problem. I read that it could be a failing winding on the armature or in the fields. It could just be a dirt/dust build up that is causing heat. Don't give up on your saw until you have tried everything that it COULD be. If it comes down to a bad motor, then you can decide whether you want to mess around with changing out the motor or stepping up to a newer saw. In my area, there are at least a dozen Hawk saws most all the time and they range from $75 to $750. I bought a 226 Ultra with 20 hours of run time on it and 20 years of sitting in the garage for $250. It was like new except the table had oxidized. It ran great. I sold it only because it took up too much floor space in my tiny shop. Best of luck.

[Scrappile]

4 hours ago, Scrappile said:

I would think you could call Advance Machinery and ask them.  They have always been helpful to me.

Sorry, my 1/2 a brain short-circuited.  Thought we were talking Hegner, until I went back and reread things.

[OCtoolguy]

3 hours ago, Scrappile said:

Sorry, my 1/2 a brain short-circuited.  Thought we were talking Hegner, until I went back and reread things.

Well, your heart was in the right place. Bless you! Lol.

[Millwab]

4 hours ago, Scrappile said:

Sorry, my 1/2 a brain short-circuited.  Thought we were talking Hegner, until I went back and reread things.

Paul, the thread started out talking about the Hawk but eventually morphed to trying to control speed on a single speed Hegner. In regards to that, I asked a retired electrical engineer friend about using the speed controllers linked to Amazon and he told me that the Short answer is No.  You wouldn’t ruin the motor but the controller would be toast.  Guess I’m going to have to put up with the Hegner's speed until I can replace it with a variable speed model. 

[JTTHECLOCKMAN]

This topic went all over the place. The engineer is correct. Never put another VS devise on a machine that has a control board that controls speeds. That is why you can not use a sewing machine foot pedal on a VS saw. I said this so many times here. 

Not sure about what saw we are talking about failing but an AC motor will hardly ever fail . Winding do not just go bad. Now a DC motor is different because you have brushes involved and a commutator. That can wear as well as the brushes. Now bearings on either type motor can cause problems that mimic a bad controller. 

[Millwab]

Back to my original question.  I’ve found that if I rotate the speed control min to max a couple times before starting the saw it prevents the motor from reving up. Not sure why it helps but for now this works.  I’ll eventually open up the control box and blow it out when I have more time to play with it. Thanx all for your help. 

[kmmcrafts]

9 hours ago, Millwab said:

Back to my original question.  I’ve found that if I rotate the speed control min to max a couple times before starting the saw it prevents the motor from reving up. Not sure why it helps but for now this works.  I’ll eventually open up the control box and blow it out when I have more time to play with it. Thanx all for your help. 

That is exactly what mine would do.. which is why I took it apart and cleaned it.. no issues after that.. In my opinion you'll want to do that sooner than later.. those spikes in speed is not good for the electronics and you risk more and permanent damage as a poor electrical connection is creating heat and will burn things up.. I wouldn't run it like this until you clean it..