Oddball question. Not scroll saw related

[OCtoolguy]

I figured that someone here might be able to answer my question and I trust the folks here. I have a 14" Delta bandsaw and I recently got access to some very exotic hard woods. I was thinking about trying to resaw some of it but I don't have a good blade. I know that 1/2" is about the maximum width blade that I SHOULD put on my saw but I don't know what brand or tooth configuration to buy. Anybody who can give me advice would be most appreciated. Thanks in advance.

Ray

 

[kmmcrafts]

I'd go with PS Woodmachines.. Timberwolf brand saw blades..  It's what I used on my old ryobi benchtop saw.. made the world of difference over those box store blades etc..

I know there are better blades than these.. but also big $$ too such as carbide blades etc.. but those Timberwolf blades are the Flying Dutchman or Pegas type blades in the scroll saw terms LOL.. They have a chart on the site that explains the different blade configurations etc.

[Dan]

I've been using Olson 1/2", 4 TPI, skip with a rake set. It works good. I just cut a bunch of maple 5" to 6". I do like Timberwolf blades also. 

[OCtoolguy]

My next question would be, once I have cut some pieces in, say 1/4" or so, how can I safely run them through my planer? I would love to have one of those big belt surface sanders but that ain't gonna happen anytime soon.

Ray

 

[kmmcrafts]

If you want to end up with 1/4" finished piece.. I'd cut it at 3/8 - 1/2" Also make sure they are going to be long enough to go through the planer safely.. I've run down to 1/4" in my planer but I get a little uncomfortable going any less than that.. also take several small passes rather than larger ones..

I also really want one of those open end drum sanders.. make cutting board making easier..    

[OCtoolguy]

2 minutes ago, kmmcrafts said:

If you want to end up with 1/4" finished piece.. I'd cut it at 3/8 - 1/2" Also make sure they are going to be long enough to go through the planer safely.. I've run down to 1/4" in my planer but I get a little uncomfortable going any less than that.. also take several small passes rather than larger ones..

I also really want one of those open end drum sanders.. make cutting board making easier..    

Thanks. But, let's say that I want to get down to some thin veneer wood for doing inlay. Is there a way to resaw some pieces at say 3/16" and then attach them in some way to a thicker board and run the whole thing through the planer? If so, how thin do you think it would be safe to plane to? If it's not possible, I'll accept that too. I'm just brainstorming here. I can buy the veneer already cut and sanded but it's not cheap.

Ray

 

[kmmcrafts]

4 minutes ago, octoolguy said:

Thanks. But, let's say that I want to get down to some thin veneer wood for doing inlay. Is there a way to resaw some pieces at say 3/16" and then attach them in some way to a thicker board and run the whole thing through the planer? If so, how thin do you think it would be safe to plane to? If it's not possible, I'll accept that too. I'm just brainstorming here. I can buy the veneer already cut and sanded but it's not cheap.

Ray

 

That is something maybe someone else has experience in.. My planer instructions indicate to not go thinner than than 3/16 ( I think is what it said ) but I get a little nervous once I get down to 1/4.. I think I did run one piece down to 3/16.. once.. Good sharp knives make a world of difference when getting down to the thin stock like that.. I don't know any way you could attach it to another piece of wood.. short of gluing it.. then that sort of defeats the purpose LOL   

[Dan]

How wide do you want the pieces? I have cut pieces to about 1/8", used double stick tape to attach them to a shooting board, and ran them though the planer to get 1/16". It's not difficult but about one of five pieces were not good enough for me to use. Of course, at that time my planer blades were not the sharpest. 

[OCtoolguy]

14 minutes ago, Dan said:

How wide do you want the pieces? I have cut pieces to about 1/8", used double stick tape to attach them to a shooting board, and ran them though the planer to get 1/16". It's not difficult but about one of five pieces were not good enough for me to use. Of course, at that time my planer blades were not the sharpest. 

Dan, that's what I was wondering. If you could either use double stick tape or hot glue. I'm thinking that the boards that I can get hold of are in the 4-6" wide by 12-18" long. Some of it is very exotic. Once piece I picked up was very heavy and had a beautiful grain to it. Sort of a chocolate brown with the grain lines very dark brown or black. 

Ray

 

[Dan]

What kind of wood? Be sure to check grain direction when planing and take very thin slices at a time. 

[JTTHECLOCKMAN]

Hello Ray

You ask alot of questions in this post and will take a long time to comment and explain but I will try to give you my shortest version. I too have a Delta open frame bandsaw. 3/4HP motor. This is not alot of HP for resawing and thus I went to carbide bandsaw blades and have used them mainly for resawing and they are Lennox. I use a 3/4" blade. They are the max that saw can handle but gives me a nice rigid back to the blade and less flex. They work great and I have cut all sorts of exotics to hard maples up to 10 " wide. I have a riser kit on my saw and you did not mention this so not sure if you do so that may hinder the height of your wood that you can resaw. You can get other blades that are less expensive but do not last as long. If you are not doing alot of resawing this may work for you. It does not for me. Here is a great place to get blades from and great people to answer questions and recommend the correct blade. http://suffolkmachinery.com/ I use them all the time. You want a blade with 2-3 teeth per inch skip tooth resaw blade. This will not get you a perfect smooth finish but will cut wood faster. Not sure how well your saw is tuned but you need a tall fence. There are two types (pivot fence where you follow a line on top of the wood when slicing and the wood rides against a half round dowel for pivoting purposes, or a flat fence like a tablesaw where you run the wood against with proper spacing) The pivot fence is more forgiving in set-up but tough to follow sometimes. If you use a flat fence it must be tuned to the blade you are using accounting for drift. All blades will have drift as well as all scrollsaw blades. That is why you scroll always to a side and not straight in a line. How to set your saw for this is too long for me to get into but you can google it or I can explain in another thread. Having a well tuned saw helps.

Always cut the slices larger than needed than mill to size needed. Having a drum sander is the best case scenario which is the way I mill my woods. You can  use a planner and hopefully your blades are in good shape. You can use a carrier board and one which I would suggest doing if getting down to 1/4" But that board needs to be dead flat and long enough to support the entire length of your pieces and then some. I prefer MDF when doing this. Now all planners will cause snipe and do not let anyone tell you theirs doesn't because it is a lie. So you need to account for this. To do this you need a leading and lagging sacrificial piece in front of and behind so that the blades plane before and past your good work piece. A method to secure the wood and sacrificial pieces to the carrier board are needed. Double sided tape will work. I prefer to use outdoor carpet tape. It has the toughest adhesive on the market. I get it in home depot in the carpet dept. Will warn you it is hard to get off so care is needed when stripping to keep from cracking the thin boards. I would only use strips on the outside edges but keep in a couple inches from the edges.  The whole key is to take light passes and you won't cause divots and tearout. Also need to feed the wood in the proper grain direction. Here is an article that can explain it better. http://www.woodworkersjournal.com/avoid-tearout-reading-grain/  After all said and done they still need sanding and random orbital or pad sander works well. Hope this helps some. Any questions I would be glad to answer. By the way if you use a carrier board you can plane down to an 1/8" if you would like. 

Edited February 14, 2018 by JTTHECLOCKMAN

[Lucky2]

Ray, are you sure you are doing inlay work, I've always used thicker wood then 1/16" for any inlay work I've ever done. On any inlay work I've ever done, the inlaid wood is about the same thickness as the wood your doing the inlay into. On any inlaid work of mine, you could see the inlaid image clearly from both sides. I don't know how you could do that, with something 1/16" thick? If you are doing Marquetry work, I can understand wanting 1/16" veneer stock. Maybe the way I do my inlay work is different then others, I'll wait to see how others reply to my reply to your question.

Len

[JTTHECLOCKMAN]

44 minutes ago, Lucky2 said:

Ray, are you sure you are doing inlay work, I've always used thicker wood then 1/16" for any inlay work I've ever done. On any inlay work I've ever done, the inlaid wood is about the same thickness as the wood your doing the inlay into. On any inlaid work of mine, you could see the inlaid image clearly from both sides. I don't know how you could do that, with something 1/16" thick? If you are doing Marquetry work, I can understand wanting 1/16" veneer stock. Maybe the way I do my inlay work is different then others, I'll wait to see how others reply to my reply to your question.

Len

Could be overlay work he is doing. 

[zimmerstutzen]

My local woodcraft store did a bandsaw tune up seminar a month ago.  The speaker was a shop teacher somewhere near by.  He of course was touting some fancy carbide blades and I was half asleep during the advertising part of his talk, but when he resale some wood into beautiful 1/8 veneer about ten inches wide he got everybody'attention.  It was sawn so smoothly it did not need planing.  Most amazing thing I have seen in years.  I immediately was thinking about the woods I had on hand and could resaw for scroll work.

[OCtoolguy]

14 hours ago, JTTHECLOCKMAN said:

Hello Ray

You ask alot of questions in this post and will take a long time to comment and explain but I will try to give you my shortest version. I too have a Delta open frame bandsaw. 3/4HP motor. This is not alot of HP for resawing and thus I went to carbide bandsaw blades and have used them mainly for resawing and they are Lennox. I use a 3/4" blade. They are the max that saw can handle but gives me a nice rigid back to the blade and less flex. They work great and I have cut all sorts of exotics to hard maples up to 10 " wide. I have a riser kit on my saw and you did not mention this so not sure if you do so that may hinder the height of your wood that you can resaw. You can get other blades that are less expensive but do not last as long. If you are not doing alot of resawing this may work for you. It does not for me. Here is a great place to get blades from and great people to answer questions and recommend the correct blade. http://suffolkmachinery.com/ I use them all the time. You want a blade with 2-3 teeth per inch skip tooth resaw blade. This will not get you a perfect smooth finish but will cut wood faster. Not sure how well your saw is tuned but you need a tall fence. There are two types (pivot fence where you follow a line on top of the wood when slicing and the wood rides against a half round dowel for pivoting purposes, or a flat fence like a tablesaw where you run the wood against with proper spacing) The pivot fence is more forgiving in set-up but tough to follow sometimes. If you use a flat fence it must be tuned to the blade you are using accounting for drift. All blades will have drift as well as all scrollsaw blades. That is why you scroll always to a side and not straight in a line. How to set your saw for this is too long for me to get into but you can google it or I can explain in another thread. Having a well tuned saw helps.

Always cut the slices larger than needed than mill to size needed. Having a drum sander is the best case scenario which is the way I mill my woods. You can  use a planner and hopefully your blades are in good shape. You can use a carrier board and one which I would suggest doing if getting down to 1/4" But that board needs to be dead flat and long enough to support the entire length of your pieces and then some. I prefer MDF when doing this. Now all planners will cause snipe and do not let anyone tell you theirs doesn't because it is a lie. So you need to account for this. To do this you need a leading and lagging sacrificial piece in front of and behind so that the blades plane before and past your good work piece. A method to secure the wood and sacrificial pieces to the carrier board are needed. Double sided tape will work. I prefer to use outdoor carpet tape. It has the toughest adhesive on the market. I get it in home depot in the carpet dept. Will warn you it is hard to get off so care is needed when stripping to keep from cracking the thin boards. I would only use strips on the outside edges but keep in a couple inches from the edges.  The whole key is to take light passes and you won't cause divots and tearout. Also need to feed the wood in the proper grain direction. Here is an article that can explain it better. http://www.woodworkersjournal.com/avoid-tearout-reading-grain/  After all said and done they still need sanding and random orbital or pad sander works well. Hope this helps some. Any questions I would be glad to answer. By the way if you use a carrier board you can plane down to an 1/8" if you would like. 

Wow! Thank you John T. That is way more info than I expected and all very good sage advice. I don't have a riser on my saw. My planer is an almost new Delta with good blades but I will still make sure of their sharpness. I will check out both of the links that you supplied. I am surprised though that you say that 3/4" is the max blade with for the bandsaw. I was under the impression that 1/2" was the max. I'm happy to find out that I can go wider. I don't plan on doing as much resawing as you do so I will not invest in the carbide tipped blade yet. This is still in the thinking/experimenting stage. I truly do want to thank you for your time to write all this out. You are the best.

Ray

 

[OCtoolguy]

10 hours ago, Lucky2 said:

Ray, are you sure you are doing inlay work, I've always used thicker wood then 1/16" for any inlay work I've ever done. On any inlay work I've ever done, the inlaid wood is about the same thickness as the wood your doing the inlay into. On any inlaid work of mine, you could see the inlaid image clearly from both sides. I don't know how you could do that, with something 1/16" thick? If you are doing Marquetry work, I can understand wanting 1/16" veneer stock. Maybe the way I do my inlay work is different then others, I'll wait to see how others reply to my reply to your question.

Len

You are correct. I should have said "marquetry". I used to call it inlay until I started doing the marquetry. The old habits are hard to break.

Ray

 

[OCtoolguy]

3 hours ago, zimmerstutzen said:

My local woodcraft store did a bandsaw tune up seminar a month ago.  The speaker was a shop teacher somewhere near by.  He of course was touting some fancy carbide blades and I was half asleep during the advertising part of his talk, but when he resale some wood into beautiful 1/8 veneer about ten inches wide he got everybody'attention.  It was sawn so smoothly it did not need planing.  Most amazing thing I have seen in years.  I immediately was thinking about the woods I had on hand and could resaw for scroll work.

What brand and size saw was he using? What width blade? What brand? How much? I would love to have sat in on that demo.

Ray

 

[JTTHECLOCKMAN]

8 hours ago, octoolguy said:

Wow! Thank you John T. That is way more info than I expected and all very good sage advice. I don't have a riser on my saw. My planer is an almost new Delta with good blades but I will still make sure of their sharpness. I will check out both of the links that you supplied. I am surprised though that you say that 3/4" is the max blade with for the bandsaw. I was under the impression that 1/2" was the max. I'm happy to find out that I can go wider. I don't plan on doing as much resawing as you do so I will not invest in the carbide tipped blade yet. This is still in the thinking/experimenting stage. I truly do want to thank you for your time to write all this out. You are the best.

Ray

 

Ray it is the HP of the saw that will dictate the size of the blade. As I said I can physically easily fit a 3/4" blade but I am pushing it with the 3/4HP some of those saws had a 1/2HP motor. The newer ones come with at least 1HP. On occasion I trip the thermal on the motor if cutting a large bunch of lumber but does not deter me. Good luck.

[Sycamore67]

Good advice given here.  I would add something.....Resawing wood is more difficult than it sounds.  You need a well set up machine, sharp blade and PRACTICE.  It is a new skill and takes some time.  

[oldhudson]

I use the Timber Wolf brand bandsaw blades exclusively (I too buy at http://suffolkmachinery.com/  ).  To plane thin stock I use a carrier board and carpet tape to hold the stock to be milled. Personally, I wouldn't try to go under 1/4".

[Bill WIlson]

I've planed wood down to less than 1/8", using a carrier board.  There really isn't much danger of damaging the planer, but depending on the grain pattern and stability of the wood being planed, you can get some significant tear out.  Be especially careful planing knots.  Those can blow out pretty dramatically when you get thin like that.  Stand off to the side when feeding the wood into the planer, in case the wood comes apart and gets kicked back.  Also, take much lighter cuts than you normally would.

[tomsteve]

those timberwolf blades are the bees knees!

as for planing thin stock, ive had the best results putting an auxiliary bed on my planer. basically a piece of 3/4" melamine  12"wide and a bit longer than the infeed and outfeed tables. then a cleat on the bottom of the melamine- both ends and right up against the infeed and outfeed tables- to keep the bed in place.

heres a little article and pics that may explain it

https://www.woodmagazine.com/woodworking-plans/jointing-and-planing/auxiliary-planer-bed

it works real well. 

ive planed some hard exotics down to 1/8" using the auxilliary bed- purpleheart, bloodwood i recall offhand. very light passes and it worked good. they dull blades real quick,though.  some day someone will donate a drum sander to the TOM foundation- a non profit organization helping woodworkers in my shop expand their abilities.

 

there are times, though, that i resaw on my table saw. with a thin kerf blade, i can get 2 pieces of 1/4" thick stock out of a 3/4" thick board.

 

 

 

[Sycamore67]

Yes, there is some hazard planing wood down to less than 1/8".  The thin board can come up, splinter or blow up.  How often,  probably not very often.  I have read posts where this has happened and small splinters lodging in the blades.

Can you do it.....yes.  but be aware that your piece needs to be well taped down.  Be careful when taking it off the tape as will be fragile.

[Scrappile]

Check the internet, if you want less that 1/8", veneer is not all that expensive.  I've purchased some great veneers off Ebay.

[hineps]

I've  had pretty good luck planing down to less than 1/8" for dulcimer material. Only problem was with some coco bolo than had some wild grain. It came apart rather abruptly. I just have apiece of melamine on the bed of the planer. I feed the stock thru in the normal fashion. On the figured wood I take to the final thickness with a drum sander. Just planed some cherry to 1/4" for a scroll project.

 

Phil