Deal or No Deal??

[ThomH]

Hello everyone,

I'm new to scrollsawvillage, new to woodworking and new to scrolling. I recently bought a 16 in Ryobi scroll saw and unfortunately, I broke the tension mechanism. I saw a 19 Excalibur for sale. Owner is asking $50 bucks. With the last Ryobi purchase ($40), plus $8 spent on tool to change blades and now $50 for this one, I am wondering....should I buy a new saw? If so, what's reliable and not so pricey for a newbie.

I mostly have been using hand saws, hand router and circular saw for projects I have done. I Like intricate cuts scroll saws can do and was attempting to make a small latch with hinges when the Ryobi went to tool grave yard.

Is the Ex a good tool? I understand it is now discontinued and finding parts will be difficult.

I got cold feet and told the owner I am no longer coming to check it out. Table is not rusty and it looks will maintained for 20 year old saw. But at $50 bucks, deal or no deal?

[kmmcrafts]

6 hours ago, ThomH said:

Hello everyone,

I'm new to scrollsawvillage, new to woodworking and new to scrolling. I recently bought a 16 in Ryobi scroll saw and unfortunately, I broke the tension mechanism. I saw a 19 Excalibur for sale. Owner is asking $50 bucks. With the last Ryobi purchase ($40), plus $8 spent on tool to change blades and now $50 for this one, I am wondering....should I buy a new saw? If so, what's reliable and not so pricey for a newbie.

I mostly have been using hand saws, hand router and circular saw for projects I have done. I Like intricate cuts scroll saws can do and was attempting to make a small latch with hinges when the Ryobi went to tool grave yard.

Is the Ex a good tool? I understand it is now discontinued and finding parts will be difficult.

I got cold feet and told the owner I am no longer coming to check it out. Table is not rusty and it looks will maintained for 20 year old saw. But at $50 bucks, deal or no deal?

Welcome to the Village..

Those older Excalibur's were nice saws back in the day I believe.. but whether it's a good deal or not is hard to say without seeing / trying it out in person. To someone looking for certain parts for their old Ex 19 this could be a steal even if the saw was rough shape so long as the needed part was good.. so value is going to vary from one persons expectations to the next. so it's really hard to put a value on old equipment. Don't get much these days for $50 unless you get really lucky on a deal.. 

As for a new saw, probably the best option that I can think of is to go with a DeWalt.. but if the money is a bit higher than you'd like to spend the basic same saw is a Delta.. I've heard of folks starting with a Porter Cable but I know nothing about those saws.. 

[Scrappile]

Welcome to the Village.  Please before buying your first saw,,,, ask here, get pictures or at least the address to a site where it can be seen... So many rush out, buy they first cheap saw the find and then are very disappointed.... Use us, as advice.  A used saw can be good... lots of good ones available... but I venture to say,,, you will not get a good saw, new or used,,, for $50.  

Edited April 7, 2021 by Scrappile

[ThomH]

Much appreciative of all the advice. Thanks guys!

[ThomH]

I saw this Dremel. It was posted 6 months ago but thought I would get feedback from the Village before I ask if it is still available.

What's your thought?

https://offerup.co/VON5rXVAffb

[Scrappile]

Well, after my other post here I hope you get some responses.... I know there are a few members here that at some time have owned a Dremel scroll saw...  I really can't comment, because I have never even seen one..  I would be a little concerned in that I don't think they still sell a scroll saw, I could be wrong, but are parts available?  

There is a write up in the Scroll Saw Reviews here (click on Resources above and the then on Scroll Saw Reviews in the drop down menu).  It is a different model than this one you are looking at.  But may be of some help.

[ThomH]

Thanks!

[kmmcrafts]

I had a Dremel but not that old of one.. The one I had was model 1800 or may have been model 1830, can't remember now but they are the same saw other than one had a disc sander on the motor shaft and the newer version of the same saw they discontinued the sander.. Mine was the one with sander.  Anyway.. the one I had wasn't a bad saw once I got it all tuned and bolted down to a solid stand.. I did have to put a piece of foam between the saw and stand to help with vibration.. The worst part I can tell you about the one I had was.. The link arm at the back of the saw that connects the upper and lower arms was nothing more than a piece of flat stock maybe 1/16 thick.. was held in place with roll pins.. Very poor design.. there needed to be some sort of bearing or something in these as they rock slightly.. The roll pins being harder steel than the flat stock would wear the holes oblong and you start getting slop in the whole saw because of this.. I only had my saw ( bought new for $150) one year and changed that flat stock piece 4 times.. 

I don't know much about this model you show here.. BUT, at the price and as old as it is.. add my personal experience with the quality of saw my newer Dremel was.. I'd probably walk away from this one.. That said though, I do recall several folks back in the day liking their saw that "looked" like this same model saw.. This saw would be from around the mid - late 1990's I bought mine in 2006-7 and was on sale as they was discontinuing the model I had with the sander and updating it with the (basically same saw ) newer model without the sander.. That newer model didn't take well for them and they discontinued making Dremel scroll saws about 2-3 years later.. 

Not to put down some of the saw brands but if I was looking for a used saw I would only consider looking at DeWalt or Delta clone of the Dewalt, Excalibur ( pre China made ) or similar saws like the Jet, Pegas, King etc. Or Hawk, Hegner.. There was a lot of cheap entry level saws back in the day such as this Dremel, that was really poorly designed. There was some quality ( for their time ) Deltas.. but those are pretty old saws now and parts are not available anymore. The other saw I'd consider but I have no personal experience with it is a Scroll Mate, Sakura, or PS Woods saw.. basically the same saw with different branding. They are made in the USA.. I've read that they are a well built saw.. but blade changes are cumbersome etc.. so take that into consideration.. I wouldn't pay much for one myself as I see them listed many times for $40 - 150..  

I'm probably forgetting some good brands of saws.. but for the most part most of the older cheaper priced saws are very old and parts are not available anymore..   

[OCtoolguy]

I offer this advice only because I'm adverse to buying anything new if you can find a good used product. I started out with a used Dewalt for $250. It was a great saw and it got greater as I learned more about it and how to maintain it. Once greased, adjusted and tuned it became a great saw. But, I found a great deal on a used Hegner and bought it. Then I found more deals on great used saws. I now have 2 of the old "green" Excaliburs that were made before manufacturing moved to China. I am in these 2 saws at zero dollars and even have money left over. It's all in the buying and selling, which I love. So, with that said, if you can find a good used saw on C/L or Marketplace, why not go that way and save money. The cost of wood is now over the top so you have to save money wherever you can. Best of luck, and welcome to the Village. The absolute best scroll saw site on the internet.

 

[preprius]

I 2nd what octoolguy says. He helped my find a great saw.   So when you see something in your nearby C/L area,  give octoolguy an email thru this site.   He can log onto C/L and check it out.  He even told me what parts of the saw to look at for wear. 

[OCtoolguy]

18 hours ago, preprius said:

I 2nd what octoolguy says. He helped my find a great saw.   So when you see something in your nearby C/L area,  give octoolguy an email thru this site.   He can log onto C/L and check it out.  He even told me what parts of the saw to look at for wear. 

Thanks but you are giving me way too much credit. I am going strictly on my own experience and what I've learned here from folks like Keving, Rolf and Scrappile. They have it all over me for knowledge. But, I know a lot more now that I did 5 years ago. Thanks to the Village.

 

[ThomH]

What do you think about Dremel? I told him I would come see it on Saturday.

https://offerup.co/mk72omTzifb

[Scrappile]

Just to give price comparison, I search within 250 miles of me on Craigslist for scroll saws... There are three Dremels like that one you are looking at.... They all looked to be in about the same condition as the one you are looking at,,,,,, by the pictures.  None showed a stand included... They were priced $45, $85 and $100.  That is quite a spread...   Looks to me like $120 is a little steep.. and it has been for sale for quite a while... If it is in good condition and you like how it feels and sounds.... Maybe offer $60 or $75 or less... He may be happy to get rid of it by now...   I have no idea what the market is in your area... Prices differ a lot depending on location.... Also investigate if you have a woodworking or scroll club some where near where you live... If so visit and asks... You may be able to try several different saws and see what appeals to you the most...

[Scrappile]

Just to give price comparison, I search within 250 miles of me on Craigslist for scroll saws... There are three Dremels like that one you are looking at.... They all looked to be in about the same condition as the one you are looking at,,,,,, by the pictures.  None showed a stand included... They were priced $45, $85 and $100.  That is quite a spread...   Looks to me like $120 is a little steep.. and it has been for sale for quite a while... If it is in good condition and you like how it feels and sounds.... Maybe offer $60 or $75 or less... He may be happy to get rid of it by now...   I have no idea what the market is in your area... Prices differ a lot depending on location.... Also investigate if you have a woodworking or scroll club some where near where you live... If so visit and asks... You may be able to try several different saws and see what appeals to you the most...

 

@octoolguy what do you think,,, your are the wheeler and dealer.   I am,... not so much

This any where near you??  https://treasure.craigslist.org/tls/d/jensen-beach-excaliber-21-scroll-saw/7282955463.html.  I would give a serious look at it if it is anywhere near your budget.... Parts are available from Seyco.  It is a great saw... Offer less like $250.  It was posted a month ago.... so maybe saws don't sell easy in your area.  It this one runs good, sounds good.... they are great saws... 

Edited April 8, 2021 by Scrappile

[ThomH]

Wow Scrappile! I appreciate your efforts in researching these finds. Thank you so much! I think his $120 asking price is based on ebay postings. Nah, I was hoping to spend $80. 

I may be hard pressed to convince the wife of spending more than $200 and that's if the saw is new.

I'm interested to see how this Dremel looks and feel. My Ryobi CVS was a little loud but then again it was not bolted to my bench.

I'm in no rush to buy so I will keep looking around. Thanks again.

 

[OCtoolguy]

12 minutes ago, Scrappile said:

Just to give price comparison, I search within 250 miles of me on Craigslist for scroll saws... There are three Dremels like that one you are looking at.... They all looked to be in about the same condition as the one you are looking at,,,,,, by the pictures.  None showed a stand included... They were priced $45, $85 and $100.  That is quite a spread...   Looks to me like $120 is a little steep.. and it has been for sale for quite a while... If it is in good condition and you like how it feels and sounds.... Maybe offer $60 or $75 or less... He may be happy to get rid of it by now...   I have no idea what the market is in your area... Prices differ a lot depending on location.... Also investigate if you have a woodworking or scroll club some where near where you live... If so visit and asks... You may be able to try several different saws and see what appeals to you the most...

 

@octoolguy what do you think,,, your are the wheeler and dealer.   I am,... not so much

This any where near you??  https://treasure.craigslist.org/tls/d/jensen-beach-excaliber-21-scroll-saw/7282955463.html.  I would give a serious look at it if it is anywhere near your budget.... Parts are available from Seyco.  It is a great saw... Offer less like $250.  It was posted a month ago.... so maybe saws don't sell easy in your area.  It this one runs good, sounds good.... they are great saws... 

I see that saw is in Florida so I'd be very cautious regarding corrosion. It looks good. It was made in Taiwan but that's not a bad thing. I bought my EX21, made in Canada, for $300 and it came with a bunch of blades and the foot switch. Even if you had to give $350 for it, it's very much like the Pegas saw but without the new Pegas blade clamps. That would run you another $100 or so, so that's where I would try to get it cheaper. The seller said,OBO so what the heck. Why not? They are great saws. I wish I was closer. I'll be there in about a month. Maybe I'll get the chance. Who knows?

 

[Scrappile]

18 minutes ago, ThomH said:

Wow Scrappile! I appreciate your efforts in researching these finds. Thank you so much! I think his $120 asking price is based on ebay postings. Nah, I was hoping to spend $80. 

I may be hard pressed to convince the wife of spending more than $200 and that's if the saw is new.

I'm interested to see how this Dremel looks and feel. My Ryobi CVS was a little loud but then again it was not bolted to my bench.

I'm in no rush to buy so I will keep looking around. Thanks again.

 

That's okay.... it is always fun to try to spend other peoples money!!  I started with an old Craftsman my wife bought me for Christmas,,, in the 1960's.. It was a mess but I used it for years as best I could... when I wanted to really get into scrolling, I upgraded to a DeWalt... Thought that was the great,,,, then got more involved and got an Excalibur,,, even greater, then heck, I love scrolling I went all out and got a hegner.... I now have the hegner, and as long as I scroll I will not part with it and and a Seyco.  Yep, you get addicted you find you want more than one saw,,,, not that you need it,, but just because... I use my Hegner most... the Seyco less but just be advised if you get hooked.... get a second job,, so you can get more saws...!!

Edited April 8, 2021 by Scrappile

[Scrappile]

7 minutes ago, octoolguy said:

I see that saw is in Florida so I'd be very cautious regarding corrosion. It looks good. It was made in Taiwan but that's not a bad thing. I bought my EX21, made in Canada, for $300 and it came with a bunch of blades and the foot switch. Even if you had to give $350 for it, it's very much like the Pegas saw but without the new Pegas blade clamps. That would run you another $100 or so, so that's where I would try to get it cheaper. The seller said,OBO so what the heck. Why not? They are great saws. I wish I was closer. I'll be there in about a month. Maybe I'll get the chance. Who knows?

 

Ray, you mean the Excalibur was a Taiwan one,,,, it is green,,, that was even before the black.. I thought all green ones were Canada??  I did notice that it did not have a tension knob in the back,,, it had the slide lever in front,,,, I thought that was surely before Taiwan saws even...  Interesting..   Help here, Ray,,, I have a feeling about @ThomH.. get him in a good saw, so he can get hooked and as miserable and broke as me.....

Edited April 8, 2021 by Scrappile

[OCtoolguy]

3 minutes ago, Scrappile said:

Ray, you mean the Excalibur was a Taiwan one,,,, it is green,,, that was even before the black.. I thought all green ones were Canada??  I did notice that it did not have a tension knob in the back,,, it had the slide lever in front,,,, I thought that was surely before Taiwan saws even...  Interesting..

I looked at the name plate on the side and it said Taiwan. My 21 is Canadian but my 16 is Taiwan. They both have the tension knob in the rear. I didn't notice that that saw had the slider. I should have looked a bit closer. The only black ones made in Taiwan, and I could be wrong, were the Special or Limited Edition ones. Not sure. Anyway, as long as it's not a Chinese saw, all good. I'm still in the hunt for another Hegner. Right now, I'm dickering on one and we are about $75 apart. He's thinking over my offer of $350 with stand, light and foot switch as well as a home brew mobile base. All I want is the saw, they can keep everything else.

 

[ThomH]

Scrappile, this made my chuckle..."get him in a good saw, so he can get hooked and as miserable and broke as me....."

You guys will drive me to get it going sooner rather than later. 

[Rockytime]

1 hour ago, octoolguy said:

I see that saw is in Florida so I'd be very cautious regarding corrosion. It looks good. It was made in Taiwan but that's not a bad thing. I bought my EX21, made in Canada, for $300 and it came with a bunch of blades and the foot switch. Even if you had to give $350 for it, it's very much like the Pegas saw but without the new Pegas blade clamps. That would run you another $100 or so, so that's where I would try to get it cheaper. The seller said,OBO so what the heck. Why not? They are great saws. I wish I was closer. I'll be there in about a month. Maybe I'll get the chance. Who knows?

 

Going to Florida? Going by way of the Springs? If so make a quick stop in Denver and I'll give you my 14" Hegner free and clear.

[OCtoolguy]

3 minutes ago, Rockytime said:

Going to Florida? Going by way of the Springs? If so make a quick stop in Denver and I'll give you my 14" Hegner free and clear.

Be careful what you wish for Les. We'll be visiting in the Springs in a month or two.

 

[Rockytime]

Then stop by and will own a Hegner, DC and the works. No charge. I am desperate for room.

[OCtoolguy]

1 minute ago, Rockytime said:

Then stop by and will own a Hegner, DC and the works. No charge. I am desperate for room.

I'll try to get up your way. Can't make any promises yet. We are heading toward the East coast via I-10 and going all the way to Key West. Then, after visitng and seeing stuff we've missed, we'll be coming West on I-40 through Tennessee, Oklahoma and then Colorado. Gonna drop back down to Flagstaff once we leave the Springs. Your offer is very generous. I would love to meet you in person too. That would be the icing on the cake.

 

[Scrappile]

@octoolguy @Rockytime   If there is any chance of a meet.... do it... There is nothing much better than meeting another member of the village.. I have met and visited with @heppnerguy and @scrollingforsanity and I consider them both my greatest friends now... It is an awesome experience... Like meeting up with old military brother.... that kind of great..!!