Intarsia question

[CSull]

Hi All,  I have been working on learning to do intarsia and have a question that maybe someone can help me with.  After I get everything cut and do my initial layout all my pieces fit well, then I alter the thickness and sand, being careful not to sand the edges.  And here is the question, when I begin my final assembly to the backer there is always one or two pieces that have gaps or don't fit properly. A couple of times I have had to re cut pieces to solve the issue.  What am I missing or is it just the nature of the beast? Any suggestions are greatly appreciated!

[GrampaJim]

I do NOT consider myself to be any kind of expert but mu first thought is your blade might not be square to the table.  Even being off just a little will cause problems.  When I setup to cut, I use a piece of 2x4 and make a slight cut, then spin it around and put the back of the blade in the slot you just cut.  It needs to be perfectly.  Also, I have a small square to check that each piece is square. 

If you haven't already get the DVD set from Judy Gail Roberts - best $30 I spent. 

https://intarsia.com/collections/books-dvds/products/intarsia-scroll-sawing-contouring-dvd-set

 

[spirithorse]

Hi, Craig,
It's nice to see how much you are participating on the forum and trying new projects.
When we 'dry fit' our pieces it is a little hard to actually keep every piece in place on most
projects to make sure they are all where we want them.
You could take the extra step to either glue the pieces onto wax paper as you assemble it
to see if everything is where it should be for your finished project. You can accomplish the same thing with
tape on the bottom of each piece as you assemble it (which is the method I use) or you could assemble it
on the self adhesive shelf liner paper but, that would be a bit more costly unless you could store the used
shelf liner somewhere and re-purpose it to attach your NEXT pattern on the liner paper and use it 
directly onto the wood.

Good luck with what-ever methods you decide to try or any new suggestions that come in.

God Bless! Spirithorse

[Dan]

I did something similar to what Bob, aka spirithorse, did. I used double-sided tape to dry fit everything. Once I was happy I began gluing. If you get the right tape you can remove the pieces and replace them back onto the tape with no issues. Just make sure you remove all the sawdust first.

[Dave Monk]

I have done less than two dozen intarsia project so I am far from an expert. I have tried to glue the pieces on the backer but it has never worked for me. I edge glue my pieces and then glue the whole project onto the backer. I know that it isn't the way the pros do it but it works best for me. I spray the whole thing with lacquer after I am all done. Again, I realize that isn't the way the pros do it. 

[ben2008]

18 hours ago, Dave Monk said:

I have done less than two dozen intarsia project so I am far from an expert. I have tried to glue the pieces on the backer but it has never worked for me. I edge glue my pieces and then glue the whole project onto the backer. I know that it isn't the way the pros do it but it works best for me. I spray the whole thing with lacquer after I am all done. Again, I realize that isn't the way the pros do it. 

That's how I do it too. I have used a lacquer finish in just the last 3 or 4 years. prior it was BLO. I have seen some of your pieces and they are excellent.

I have made about the same amount in my 30 years of Intarsia. One a year or every other year for me. I have too many other interests. Some of my Intarsia turn out really good, some others are just OK. I'm no expert.

I tried to do it like Judy Gale Roberts. I just couldn't get it right. I believe there is no wrong way to do Intarsia. It's the end results that matter. However, some people just don't get it and should find something else to do. Just my opinion. 

 

Edited May 29, 2021 by ben2008

[meflick]

You are correct, it is somewhat the nature of the beast. I believe if you talked to Judy Gale Robert’s, she would tell you even with all her years of experience and expertise, there are times she has to recut a piece. If you have not reviewed the articles and FAQ section on her website, https://intarsia.com , then I highly recommend it as she has great info. on there. This article in particular, https://intarsia.com/blogs/news/glueing-intarsia, may be helpful for you to review. She does not edge glue, she explains why in that article. One thing she shows and tells in her classes is to NOT cut the backer board from the original pattern. What she does, and shows to do in classes, is to use your final piece after sanding to trace for your backer board. She takes a piece of paper, sprays it with repositionable  adhesive and then lays the pieces out on it so that they adhere well enough to stay in place so you can trace around the project and then use it to create a pattern for your backer. This way, it creates a piece that better fits the project because when crafting and cutting, you will lose some of the overall size from the original pattern from the blade kerf, sanding and shaping, etc. She also uses a wipe on finish and does each piece separately rather than using a spray finish after the piece is all glued down.

Edited May 30, 2021 by meflick

[spirithorse]

Aha! Good point, @Dave Monk
I also edge glue my pieces and
Thank You @meflick for the article from Judy Gale Roberts about why she does NOT edge glue the pieces.

I adore Judy Gale Roberts and her expertise but, I will continue to do what has worked well for me and
hopefully I do not use so much glue that it would cause any gaps.

@CSull  Thanks for the discussion starter!
God Bless! Spirithorse

[CSull]

8 hours ago, ben2008 said:

That's how I do it too. I have used a lacquer finish in just the last 3 or 4 years. prior it was BLO. I have seen some of your pieces and they are excellent.

I have made about the same amount in my 30 years of Intarsia. One a year or every other year for me. I have too many other interests. Some of my Intarsia turn out really good, some others are just OK. I'm no expert.

I tried to do it like Judy Gale Roberts. I just couldn't get it right. I believe there is no wrong way to do Intarsia. It's the end results that matter. However, some people just don't get it and should find something else to do. Just my opinion. 

 

Well maybe I just don't get it. I guess I could find something else to do.

[ben2008]

6 hours ago, CSull said:

Well maybe I just don't get it. I guess I could find something else to do.

I have re-cut pieces quite often. Not so much anymore.  I find what others have said. Keeping your blade 90 degrees to the table while cutting is the number one reason for having to re-cut a piece. I also find using the smallest blade cuts down on mistakes and helps create a closer fit in my opinion. Let the blade do the work, don't push to hard as you will have tendency to wander. I always try to cut to the center of the line. The last one is slow down the speed of the saw. I'm in no hurry.  I have been doing Intarsia for over 30 years and I still make my share of mistakes. I edge glue the pieces together and have done it that way since i started. The more you do it, the better success you will have. Just my opinion and don't give up. Good luck.

Edited May 30, 2021 by ben2008

[meflick]

13 hours ago, spirithorse said:

Aha! Good point, @Dave Monk
I also edge glue my pieces and
Thank You @meflick for the article from Judy Gale Roberts about why she does NOT edge glue the pieces.

I adore Judy Gale Roberts and her expertise but, I will continue to do what has worked well for me and
hopefully I do not use so much glue that it would cause any gaps.

@CSull  Thanks for the discussion starter!
God Bless! Spirithorse

@spirithorse welcome. I would encourage anyone to do what they find works for them. I try to learn from everyone and find what works for me on any hobby I partake. There are no right or wrong ways usually, just different ways. I have the benefit of basically living in JGR’s backyard (about 35-40 minutes away), so when I became interested in learning Intarsia, and knew that I could takes lessons from her, I started by taking her classes right away so I learned from her from the beginning. So for me, I didn’t learn my own way first. However, that doesn’t mean I haven’t adapted other ways as I have progressed since either.
 

9 hours ago, CSull said:

Well maybe I just don't get it. I guess I could find something else to do.

tell us what go “just don’t get” and perhaps we can try to help further.  As already noted, you simply have to find what works for you, the look that you like, accept that there will be small kerf gaps, it’s the nature of the beast, and sometimes we all need to recut a piece and make mistakes gluing it together. I think we all learn from each project that we craft, and I think most of us can always point out our “flaws” where no one else would see or notice, they just see the beauty in the piece. We all approach pieces differently, and have different ideas as to how to sand and what we want that final piece to look. For example, some people do very little sanding, just round over the edges and glue up. Others want more depth and dimension and spend hours and hours for days on end, sometimes weeks, sanding and shaping each little piece. Others still settle somewhere in between. As long as what they craft makes them happy and they like it, then they have done it right. keep crafting the next Intarsia piece and learn from each one, learn what you like and makes you happy. That is all that matters.

Edited May 30, 2021 by meflick

[spirithorse]

16 hours ago, CSull said:

Well maybe I just don't get it. I guess I could find something else to do.

Hi, Craig,
I hope none of my suggestions made you think you just don't get it.
You have shown some excellent projects and I enjoy seeing your posts.
You definitely seem inquisitive enough to ask questions about various topics and
I hope to see you do some intarsia for us to admire.

I'd like to do a lot more intarsia but, those projects generally take more time to cut than
portraits or fretwork and I haven't been selling much recently because I do not have a payment
system like PayPal set up and the pandemic.

I'll gather up some photos of some of the intarsia pieces I have completed and maybe that will inspire you
to say, "I could do that!"

God Bless! Spirithorse

[trailfndr]

Craig,  One of the things I have learned over the years, is that during assembly, if you get one piece glued down even a couple of millimeters off,  others simply wont fit.  This could possibly be part of the problem you are seeing.  To avoid this is not always easy, but it is why I edge glue using CA glue,  A couple of drops and a few seconds of holding things together, keeps things lined up.  CA also doesn't tend to expand the way wood glues do.  Even with my best efforts, and over 200 projects under my belt,  I STILL have occasional fit issues when I assemble.  No system that I have tried is fool proof.  We as artists are very critical of what we see as a flaw, step back, and look at it thru the eyes of an outsider, and you will see a different result.  I have sold a lot of pieces and not once has anyone said anything less than complimentary about my work.  The average person will never look at or even see, the gaps,  they look at the overall piece and see it differently than we, the artist see.

In other words,  RELAX, and don't be so critical of yourself.  You are going to end up with some small gaps, and that's ok  Most people will never see them.