Trinket Box - sanding

[ScrollerGuy]

I'm rather new to scroll sawing and woodworking in general. After watching the 'Designing A Trinket Box' tutorial on this site I decided to give it a try. I used 3/4 inch pine for the sides but I'm having trouble sanding them smooth. I have tried several grit sandpapers from 150 to 320 and just can't get it smooth. Perhaps pine is just too soft to sand smooth? Any tips or suggestions?

[Scrappile]

When I make a little box like that, I worry about sanding the sides before attaching the bottom or anything that sticks out farther than the sides.  I can then do a lot of smoothing on a disc. spindle or belt sander.  doing it by hand is tough, especially when sanding end grain.

[ScrollerGuy]

18 minutes ago, Scrappile said:

When I make a little box like that, I worry about sanding the sides before attaching the bottom or anything that sticks out farther than the sides.  I can then do a lot of smoothing on a disc. spindle or belt sander.  doing it by hand is tough, especially when sanding end grain.

Oh, it's not glued up yet, just set into place. I'll look into getting a small spindle sander for the drill press. Maybe that will do the trick. Thanks

[Scrappile]

5 hours ago, ScrollerGuy said:

Oh, it's not glued up yet, just set into place. I'll look into getting a small spindle sander for the drill press. Maybe that will do the trick. Thanks

Good, that makes it a lot more manageable.  I added spindle sander thinking of sanding the inside wall.  But it may help some on the outside.  But still the fact it is not glued up still makes it easier.   Sandpaper glued to various shaped backers are helpful.  I may be talking our of turn.  I have made some little boxes like that but not with such scalloped sides.  Mine were more straight so the belt/disc sander covered most of them.

[rjweb]

Very nice box for just starting out, RJ

[JTTHECLOCKMAN]

Not going to happen in my opinion. Pine has grain that is harder than heart wood. Will not sand the same degree. Even if you do get it smooth it will not stay because again the heartwood in pine will expand and contract more than grain which is very resinous. If you are going to make those I suggest use a hard wood. Especially end grain. 

Edited August 10, 2024 by JTTHECLOCKMAN

[ScrollerGuy]

9 hours ago, JTTHECLOCKMAN said:

Not going to happen in my opinion. Pine has grain that is harder than heart wood. Will not sand the same degree. Even if you do get it smooth it will not stay because again the heartwood in pine will expand and contract more than grain which is very resinous. If you are going to make those I suggest use a hard wood. Especially end grain. 

You're probably right. It seems that as I get one area smooth another area worsens, as if bits of softer wood are dislodged and then fall out leaving pits. What I need is a magical solution that will temporarily harden the wood until it can be sanded smooth. It would have to be volatile so that it doesn't have a negative effect on staining/finishing. Yeah, I know it's a unicorn.

I initially chose to use pine because the color was a good match with the Baltic Birch plywood top and bottom. Next time I'll avoid pine and go with a harder wood. 

To avoid the problem with smoothing the end grain on pine, perhaps pine slices could be used instead of boards? This would place the end grain on the top and bottom and the face grain on the inside and outside. Using a single slice around 1.5 inches thick would make for a nice outward appearance. Do slices scroll well? 

 

[Wichman]

There's a couple of things going on here.

The first is the tear out from cutting. You can reduce this by using a smaller blade/higher tooth count blade. What blade(s) were you using? The tear out hides when sanding, the sawdust fills the tear out and then when you clear the dust the tear out becomes visible again.

Another issue, especially with pine and fir, is that the difference in hardness between the light and dark is pretty extreme. If you sand with anything other than a hard backed sand paper ( a sanding block or a sander with a hard platen ) the softer areas will get sanded more than the harder lines, this is also true with hardwoods with distinct lines ( zebra wood ). A light touch with the sanding will produce better results than a more aggressive approach

And finally, you could try a sanding sealer ( thinned shellac ) to harden the wood so it will sand more uniformly.

[ScrollerGuy]

2 hours ago, Wichman said:

There's a couple of things going on here.

The first is the tear out from cutting. You can reduce this by using a smaller blade/higher tooth count blade. What blade(s) were you using? The tear out hides when sanding, the sawdust fills the tear out and then when you clear the dust the tear out becomes visible again.

Another issue, especially with pine and fir, is that the difference in hardness between the light and dark is pretty extreme. If you sand with anything other than a hard backed sand paper ( a sanding block or a sander with a hard platen ) the softer areas will get sanded more than the harder lines, this is also true with hardwoods with distinct lines ( zebra wood ). A light touch with the sanding will produce better results than a more aggressive approach

And finally, you could try a sanding sealer ( thinned shellac ) to harden the wood so it will sand more uniformly.

I tried two blades when cutting the stacked sides which were 2 x 3/4" pine. I started with a Flying Dutchman Scroll Reverse #7 which didn't seem to cut at all. The only bigger, more aggressive blade I had was the one that came with the saw. I have no idea what size it was, but yes, it may have caused some tear out. Funny that I stack cut to reduce the amount of sanding needed but may have actually increased it.

Thanks for your sanding tips. Hopefully I can get it to look at least a little better than it does now. If not, I've at least learned something with this project.

 

 

[Dave Monk]

I try to stay away from boxes like that. I'm too impatient to sand the inside points good. Looks to me that you've done a good job though.