Older Hawk Saw Question - Back and Forth Blade Movement

[stevan]

I seem to be more aware of the back and forth blade movement on my 20 year old Hawk and I'm wondering if it is excessive or not.  I don't really have any other reference than you other Hawk owners.

It looks like I am getting at least 1/32" back and forth blade movement.  It may be more than 1/32" but it's not 1/16".  Is this excessive or about normal?

As always thanks for any comments.

[SCROLLSAW703]

you shouldn't have any back & forth blade movement, other than what your blade holders allow. If your tension isn't adjusted right, you may get some movement. 

Have you got the barrel type blade holders? 

[stevan]

There is back and forth motion due to the arms going up and down.  I think it's common on most any saw.  I'm just trying to find out if my is excessive.  Yes, I have the lower barrel type blade holders.

[kmmcrafts]

How did you go about measuring that? I ask because I have the older Hawk with the barrel clamps.. I'm pretty sure mine has much more movement than that.. My newer Hawk I have two positions for the lower blade holder to fit into.. one position is for a more aggressive ( faster ) cutting and the other is more for slower higher detailed pieces.. 

I would think all of the older Hawks should have the same amount of movement.. I would also think that if your saw was worn so much so that would make this movement much more than how it was designed for it would be very noisy running and also seems like you'd have more issues than just the forward back motion of the blade..  

[SCROLLSAW703]

Thats kinda what I was tryin' to get at, km. How it's measured, & where? And Steven, I'm perfectly aware that ALL scroll saws have back & forth movement. I'm a Hawk owner myself. And owned a 220 until I wore it out.

What shape is the wedge & back of the top arm in? you might be getting some movement there? If that wedge is worn, or the top arm is worn, you'll get some movement. If it's extremely worn, it'll have to be sent to bushton for repair, & a new wedge. 

[stevan]

Everything is in good shape.  While the saw is old, it was hardly used when I got it and I have not scrolled enough to wear anything out.

I simply put a block of wood against the rear the blade and then hand turn it through one revolution.  The block moves about 1/32" (or just a fuzz more).

[SCROLLSAW703]

If a 1/32" is all the "back & forth movement" you're gettin', & everything else is in line, no major noises to speak of, I'd have to say your movement is coming from the blade holders. 

Is it cuttin' ok? Following the line of your patterns ok? If it is, run it. You could try replacing the top & bottom blade holders. Just get one barrel holder & a new top blade holder & see if it changes anything, but I have my doubts.

Are you gettin' any movement in your cam lock at the nose of the top arm? Or does yours have that? If it doesn't, that would rule that out. But if it does, there is an adjustment for the cam release, & lube it w/dry graphite in the top of the arm.

[kmmcrafts]

2 hours ago, SCROLLSAW703 said:

If a 1/32" is all the "back & forth movement" you're gettin', & everything else is in line, no major noises to speak of, I'd have to say your movement is coming from the blade holders. 

Is it cuttin' ok? Following the line of your patterns ok? If it is, run it. You could try replacing the top & bottom blade holders. Just get one barrel holder & a new top blade holder & see if it changes anything, but I have my doubts.

Are you gettin' any movement in your cam lock at the nose of the top arm? Or does yours have that? If it doesn't, that would rule that out. But if it does, there is an adjustment for the cam release, & lube it w/dry graphite in the top of the arm.

Maybe? I have a older Hawk with the barrel clamps.. and I do not see that set screw thing like you mentioned in my post the other day.. I see no way to adjust this on my old Hawk.. because I think it needs it too.. but I didn't see no set screw.. is there one in a different spot? I hadn't had a chance to really look it over good.. but there isn't anything there on the same spot as my newer Hawk has..

 

[stevan]

9 hours ago, kmmcrafts said:

Maybe? I have a older Hawk with the barrel clamps.. and I do not see that set screw thing like you mentioned in my post the other day.. I see no way to adjust this on my old Hawk.. because I think it needs it too.. but I didn't see no set screw.. is there one in a different spot? I hadn't had a chance to really look it over good.. but there isn't anything there on the same spot as my newer Hawk has..

 

I only have a lower barrel clamp.  The upper is an older style with a thumb screw (that is new) and there is no way to adjust my Hawk either.  Given the information my friends have provided, I have concluded that this movement is just inherent to this style of Hawk saw.  The only place it is a bit of an annoyance is when I want to spin the work by placing the work against the rear of the blade and spinning it.  It just moves that 1/32" and bugs the crap out of me.  Maybe as my skill improves.....

Thanks Mates!

Edited September 10, 2017 by stevan

[Dan]

Stevan, I don't have a Hawk but I'm very familiar with your issue. My Delta P-20 had the same issue with no way to adjust it. It was a problem with compound cuts and puzzles. I added some shims to the rear table mounting bolts. The blade motion didn't change but relative to the table it is now an almost perfect 90 degree front-to-back cut. Even with a #1 blade and 3/4" wood the puzzles pieces slide together nicely. I'm not sure if you can do this with your Hawk but it may be worth looking into. 

[SCROLLSAW703]

KM, the 3/32" hex screw i was tellin' you about is on the underneath side of the top arm, in the cam release area. It's kinda hard to find the first time. If you've got a small mirror you can run along the bottom of the top arm & see it without standin' on your head, it's easier to find. Once ya find it, adjust it about a 1/4 of a turn, maybe a little more, just til your cam lock feels like it has a little resistance agin' it. Don't adjust it to much or it won't completely lock with a blade in the holders. Then squirt a puff of dry graphite in the hole just above that for lube of the cam.

[kmmcrafts]

9 hours ago, SCROLLSAW703 said:

KM, the 3/32" hex screw i was tellin' you about is on the underneath side of the top arm, in the cam release area. It's kinda hard to find the first time. If you've got a small mirror you can run along the bottom of the top arm & see it without standin' on your head, it's easier to find. Once ya find it, adjust it about a 1/4 of a turn, maybe a little more, just til your cam lock feels like it has a little resistance agin' it. Don't adjust it to much or it won't completely lock with a blade in the holders. Then squirt a puff of dry graphite in the hole just above that for lube of the cam.

Yeah, I found that screw on my 26" saw and adjusted it.. no more blade breakage so far... but not on my older 220VS saw.. I'll look again but, I don't think I have one on the older saw..