Trying to joint with a table saw - not good enough

Joe W. · January 19, 2023

My daughter requested I make her a small table for the laundry room where she could fold clothes and have the laundry baskets underneath. 29" deep by 48" wide.
Using 2"x6" S2S 8 foot long select pine boards from Lowes I cut in half length.
Got the table saw out to shave/square off the edges for gluing them up and that's when the trouble started.
I'm getting a concave cut in the middle of the boards.
I bought a new 40tooth blade and tried a couple things I saw on You Tube, but still having the concave issue - the gap between boards is approx. 1/16" to 1/32".
While the gaps goes away when clamped, I'm afraid the glue joint won't be strong enough because much of the glue will be squeezed out.
So I'm looking for suggestions - and/or - a reality check, as in, am I expecting to much from my table saw to do that good of jointing? (do I need to buy a jointer?)
By the way, in addition to buying a new blade, I did use a digital angle meter to get a 90 degree blade angle relative to the table.
sign me Frustrated and disapointed.

OCtoolguy · January 19, 2023

16 minutes ago, Joe W. said:

My daughter requested I make her a small table for the laundry room where she could fold clothes and have the laundry baskets underneath. 29" deep by 48" wide.
Using 2"x6" S2S 8 foot long select pine boards from Lowes I cut in half length.
Got the table saw out to shave/square off the edges for gluing them up and that's when the trouble started.
I'm getting a concave cut in the middle of the boards.
I bought a new 40tooth blade and tried a couple things I saw on You Tube, but still having the concave issue - the gap between boards is approx. 1/16" to 1/32".
While the gaps goes away when clamped, I'm afraid the glue joint won't be strong enough because much of the glue will be squeezed out.
So I'm looking for suggestions - and/or - a reality check, as in, am I expecting to much from my table saw to do that good of jointing? (do I need to buy a jointer?)
By the way, in addition to buying a new blade, I did use a digital angle meter to get a 90 degree blade angle relative to the table.
sign me Frustrated and disapointed.

Probably not the blade as much as your fence may be out of whack. Are you sure your fence is in alignment with the blade? I bought a dial indicator and measured my blade to fence front and back of the blade using the same tooth. I had to re-adjust the fence to get it aligned correctly. There are videos on how to tune up your saw. Mine is a jobsite saw but it cuts true now. Good luck.

Dak0ta52 · January 19, 2023

I agree with Ray. I would think the problem is in your fence. I've got a cheap Kobalt worksite table saw and trued it up after watching Youtube videos as Ray mentioned. It cuts very true now and I could do glue-ups by just planning with the table saw. If you think you'll be doing a lot of work where you would be jointing wood, I would highly recommend a jointer. Even though my table saw does really well, I don't believe there is much that can beat a jointer. A thickness planer also works good kocking off the rounded corners of construction 2X4s. If the pocketbook will allow it, the spiral blade jointer or planer do much better than the 2 or 3 blade models. Mine come out as smooth as a baby's bottom.

munzieb · January 19, 2023

I had similar issues with my old Craftsman 13. Tablesaw fence. I would pull down the tension handle and see it bow inward. It also would not true up between the front and back and always spent time aligning it. I finally broke down and bought a Shop Fox Fence (Love It!!) Not cheap but well worth eliminating the constant frustration. Measurements are always true.

Bill WIlson · January 19, 2023

Are you sure the boards were straight to begin with?

Joe W. · January 19, 2023

6 minutes ago, Bill WIlson said:

Are you sure the boards were straight to begin with?

Yes . . . I put a 4 foot level on the edge prior to cutting to verify.
I'll revisit the fence as suggested above and give that a try.

scrollerpete · January 19, 2023

If you say that there is no gap between the boards when you put the clamps on, you are fine, I would use Titebond III glue and don’t be shy on the application leave it clamp overnight and it will never come apart guarantee.

Scrappile · January 19, 2023

You could also put some dowels in the edge to strengthen the glue joint if you want. However I agree with @scrollerpete It well probably be fine.

Bill WIlson · January 19, 2023

3 hours ago, scrollerpete said:

If you say that there is no gap between the boards when you put the clamps on, you are fine, I would use Titebond III glue and don’t be shy on the application leave it clamp overnight and it will never come apart guarantee.

I would tend to agree. In fact, there is a name for this. It's called a "spring joint" and is a common woodworking technique, intentionally leaving this gap in the middle, so that the ends come under greater compression when the boards are clamped together. Since the boards are pine, they are likely pliant enough to readily draw tight together and stay put, with no problems.

Sycamore67 · January 19, 2023

Before I guess at the problem, it would be great to know what table saw and see a picture. What table saw blade? Brand and kerf? Not all blades are created equal. I use a24 tooth full kerf blade for ripping...Freud blue line rip.

Freddie · January 19, 2023

If you are ripping boards, sometimes they will bow after cutting due to stress in the wood being relieved. I agree that if you clamp them and it it tight, go with it. I use biscuits about every six inches to help keep the boards aligned and some added strength. You can use dowels as well but they are harder for me to get right. I use yellow wood glue and have not had any issues. Just make sure you spread the glue out for good coverage. Hope this helped.

Joe W. · January 20, 2023

7 hours ago, Sycamore67 said:

Before I guess at the problem, it would be great to know what table saw and see a picture. What table saw blade? Brand and kerf? Not all blades are created equal. I use a24 tooth full kerf blade for ripping...Freud blue line rip.

I'll get a pic on that tomorrow. For now, a 40 tooth ATB+R Dewalt blade (DWA11040) and Dewalt 7491 Job Site Table Saw

new2woodwrk · January 20, 2023

Agreed, need pics!

However, does sound like the saw is not aligned properly. Are you using a sacrificial fence? I had this problem not long ago, drove me nut until I changed the sacrificial fence out and replaced it with another straight edge. For me, problem solved.

There are some really good table saw tune up videos on YT if you need

Sycamore67 · January 20, 2023

It will be difficult with the general purpose blade and a jobsite saw. I would make certain that the fence is straight, properly aligned and not moving. A god rip blade would likely help. Working on longer boards also can cause issues. I would try a featherboard to hold board against the fence.

Joe W. · January 21, 2023

48 minutes ago, new2woodwrk said:

There are some really good table saw tune up videos on YT if you need

Yeah, I just overdosed on most of them.
I did stop by HF today and picked up a dial indicator.
Earlier today, Murphy's Law paid me a visit - got ready to leave the house and could not find my phone. ARGH! (and a lot of other not so nice words).
Spent the next two-three hours looking for it - here, there, everywhere, including places I went to yesterday.
Returned home, told my wife and after awhile heard her announce "Marco - Polo".
Right by the closet door behind a sign on a table. Exactly where I put it yesterday after coming into the house. God, I love that woman!
Anyway, will get into it - tuning the table saw - in the next couple of days.
Pics still coming.

Joe W. · January 23, 2023

Here are a couple photos of the wood pieces for glue up.

To me, it looks like way too much gap.
Using clamps tightens up the gaps a lot, but I'm concerned tightening the clamps up too much will result in poor glued up joints and possibly come apart.

I'm waiting for a warmer day to use the dial indicator on the table saw to verify blade and fence are properly adjusted.

OCtoolguy · January 23, 2023

19 minutes ago, Joe W. said:

Here are a couple photos of the wood pieces for glue up.

To me, it looks like way too much gap.
Using clamps tightens up the gaps a lot, but I'm concerned tightening the clamps up too much will result in poor glued up joints and possibly come apart.

I'm waiting for a warmer day to use the dial indicator on the table saw to verify blade and fence are properly adjusted.

To my old eyes, the gaps appear to be fairly uniform from one end to the other. I don't see any bowing or closing up at the ends or in the middle. How do they look if you turn the boards over? Also, are you alternating your grains? If the gaps look better on one side than the other, your blade isn't perpendicular to the table. Just brainstorming here. Try laying out the boards in the order that you will be gluing them up. How do the gaps look when you do that? If they are all about the same, I'd go ahead and glue them up. Don't over clamp them to close the gaps. The glue is stronger that the wood. Let us know what you decide.

new2woodwrk · January 29, 2023

On 1/20/2023 at 6:45 PM, Joe W. said:

Yeah, I just overdosed on most of them.
I did stop by HF today and picked up a dial indicator.
Earlier today, Murphy's Law paid me a visit - got ready to leave the house and could not find my phone. ARGH! (and a lot of other not so nice words).
Spent the next two-three hours looking for it - here, there, everywhere, including places I went to yesterday.
Returned home, told my wife and after awhile heard her announce "Marco - Polo".
Right by the closet door behind a sign on a table. Exactly where I put it yesterday after coming into the house. God, I love that woman!
Anyway, will get into it - tuning the table saw - in the next couple of days.
Pics still coming.

I always ask the wife to call me when I lose my phone - works every time

tomsteve · February 2, 2023

On 1/23/2023 at 5:21 PM, Joe W. said:

I'm waiting for a warmer day to use the dial indicator on the table saw to verify blade and fence are properly adjusted.

it reads like youre going to try to align blade with fence. if so, the best thing to do is align blade with miter slot then align fence with miter slot.

Edited February 2, 2023 by tomsteve

Jim Finn · April 20, 2023

On 1/18/2023 at 9:58 PM, Joe W. said:

My daughter requested I make her a small table for the laundry room where she could fold clothes and have the laundry baskets underneath. 29" deep by 48" wide.
Using 2"x6" S2S 8 foot long select pine boards from Lowes I cut in half length.
Got the table saw out to shave/square off the edges for gluing them up and that's when the trouble started.
I'm getting a concave cut in the middle of the boards.
I bought a new 40tooth blade and tried a couple things I saw on You Tube, but still having the concave issue - the gap between boards is approx. 1/16" to 1/32".
While the gaps goes away when clamped, I'm afraid the glue joint won't be strong enough because much of the glue will be squeezed out.
So I'm looking for suggestions - and/or - a reality check, as in, am I expecting to much from my table saw to do that good of jointing? (do I need to buy a jointer?)
By the way, in addition to buying a new blade, I did use a digital angle meter to get a 90-degree blade angle relative to the table.
sign me Frustrated and disappointed.

What you need is a low count tooth blade called a "Planer " Blade in a table saw.. (Lower the better 24-29)

This blade is the only blade I ever use in my table saw. (I do crosscuts in my miter saw)

Gene Howe · May 12, 2023

A good blade is essential. All my TS and scms blades are Tenryu blades. They make a series just for miter Saws. They really need to have the proper rake for the best cut. Their 24 tooth rip blades are great.

Sycamore67 · May 12, 2023

I used a Freud Glue Line Rip blade on my Sawstop for this type of glue jobs.

Gene Howe · May 13, 2023

13 hours ago, Sycamore67 said:

I used a Freud Glue Line Rip blade on my Sawstop for this type of glue jobs.

I'm not a fan of red blades. Though they do hide the blood. Seriously, Freud Glue Line Rip Blades don't perform (for me) the task they are sold to do. But, I know I'm in the minority with that opinion.

Sycamore67 · May 13, 2023

28 minutes ago, Gene Howe said:

I'm not a fan of red blades. Though they do hide the blood. Seriously, Freud Glue Line Rip Blades don't perform (for me) the task they are sold to do. But, I know I'm in the minority with that opinion.

That is interesting. What table saw are you using? How are they not performing ?

I have had very good luck with the Freud blades. They cut perfectly for me and the price is reasonable. I often change blades on my saw to fit the task. For cutting cabinet Plywood or Baltic Birch i use a Freud Premier Fusion which is a high ATB and gives a perfect cut.

Scrappile · May 13, 2023

When I had my craftsman table saw, I replaced the fence with a Mule Cabinetmakers fence. I loved the fence, simple to install, easy to use, and very accurate. You do not read or hear alot about them, but I loved mine. Like everything the price is double now from what I paid for mine,

https://www.mulecab.com/M1025Rip.html

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Trying to joint with a table saw - not good enough

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