Pricing your Work for Shows

[David Lehner]

I would be surprised if this has not been discussed in the past … but here it is

 

Does anyone have a formula or method they use for pricing their work when doing a craft show.  I know that the market will dictate to a degree. When I do shows in this area there are maybe one or two other scrollers there also. We all do different types of work. One does mainly religious things, another only Christmas ornaments. I have a whole series of framed prairie scenes, wildlife scenes, scroll clocks of many different styles and sizes…. I also have seasonal items … My Christmas ornaments and decorations are mainly 3D.

On all framed and matted pictures I leave the glass off (if the frame includes glass) as it reduces the weight and people don’t realize the picture is cut out of wood (ususally 1/8 baltic birch for me) unless they can touch it to see it’s not a print.

 

So I have no "market" in my area to compare to.....

 

My rule of thumb is to figure about $10.00 per hour for the cutting time, finishing and framing. . Intricate pieces I figure more per hour for cutting.Then add the price of wood, backing, frame etc. I do stack cut so if  a project takes a longer time to cut it gets pro-rated by the number I create.

 

I also have a “do it yourself†kit. Sometimes I have been told that what I do does not seem that difficult. I offer them the “do it yourself†kit for a fraction of the price. The kit includes a couple blades, a pattern and a piece of wood.  Framing is extra...

 

I am open to suggestions as most customers do not understand the time and skill set involved.

[WayneMahler]

Hi Dave. Yes, you are right, this has been discussed here and many other forums at great length.I also agree that most customers have no clue about what it takes to create what do, show, design and the list goes on.You seem to have the general idea down, rate x time for the price. I have used this for years and add about 20% for material and supplies. Blades, sand paper, glue, hangers etc. Also if I place it behind glass, the glass is added to the price. I have a local place I get my glass from and he is more then reasonably priced. As you get out to shows, you will get a feel for what the market will bear. If your cutting a piece and selling it for $25 and have trouble keeping up, raise the price a bit and you will find a balance  point that your and the market can live with.One thing I have done is I created a piece, was selling it for $40, it would not move. I raised the price to $65 and it sold in 10 minutes and got 5 orders for more of it. Go figure. That told me the the customer have a perception of value to them. Take time with you customers, and listen to what they have to say, you will learn a lot. Also don't be shy about telling them about the time it takes to make a piece. My wife is great at this and has great selling skills. Best of luck, I'm sure others will chime in with their thoughts and opinions. I can only tell you what works for me and in my area. Areas are as diverse as people also.

[MTCowpoke22]

I've just started going to shows, and generally, do the same thing you do as far as calculating time and materials. I'm probably the closest "SS Village" member to you, and agree that there really isn't a market here for our types of products. Of the very few shows I've been to, I'm definitely the only scroller, and usually the only woodworker in the building. I'm doing more and more stack cutting to try to bring down my prices as it seems people are only going to pay so much pretty wall hangings over here. I've been told that I'm just using one of those fancy laser machines, and therefore shouldn't be charging so much. Eyebrows go up when I explain that every piece is hand cut on a saw.

[David Lehner]

I get the "laser" comments also.... I show them on a basswood piece that if it were laser cut there would be burnt edges from the laser... with a scroll saw that does not happen.... 

Again I have had better luck not using glass.... I give all my glass panels to local artists (watercolor) art work for the most part as they use glass on their pictures.

I refer to it as the "Charley Brown" syndrome.... Your either the hero or the goat when it comes to selling. 

Hero has the right piece at the right price at the right time....

Goat has just the opposite.... seems I am in goat syndrome quite often....

At one time it seemed all I could sell was wall clocks..... then it was desk clocks.... One never knows

 

At times I thought about doubling the price and taking a 30% discount... sometimes it works 

[David Lehner]

I've just started going to shows, and generally, do the same thing you do as far as calculating time and materials. I'm probably the closest "SS Village" member to you, and agree that there really isn't a market here for our types of products. Of the very few shows I've been to, I'm definitely the only scroller, and usually the only woodworker in the building. I'm doing more and more stack cutting to try to bring down my prices as it seems people are only going to pay so much pretty wall hangings over here. I've been told that I'm just using one of those fancy laser machines, and therefore shouldn't be charging so much. Eyebrows go up when I explain that every piece is hand cut on a saw.

 

Mr. Montana Cowpoke ....It seems you are not too far away from Minot, ND ... relatively speaking.... you may even be able to pick up my radio show without the iHeart radio app..... KCJB 910 AM

[ike]

It is hard to price items I need at least #10 pr hour at cutting time. but again most items has to be less than @ $20 to sell in my area, If you have something that the public has not seen before you can up that price a little II have some lighted Nativity scenes they I sell for $30   The main thing is to price the ITEM AT THE PRICE THAT THE PUBLIC WILL PAY iF YOU DON'T MAKE YOU SET PRICE PR HOUR DON'T MAKE IT

ike.

[JTTHECLOCKMAN]

People have been doing this for many many many years and still have not figured out the simple solution because there is none. Wayne summed it up well. The more shows you do you get a feel for what sells and what prices to charge. After awhile you will be able to tell what type project it was and what to charge. You will never get paid for the time you spent on making it and selling it. Impossible. remember you are carrying the pieces to the show and returning them when not sold and doing this over and over. you are setting up and paying for the space. This all gets calculated in a piece. No way to put a price on that. Just be happy with what you are selling and if you find a niche then run with it. Things change from year to year and show to show. Enjoy what you are doing and when it becomes a job then get out unless you love it that much. Good luck with your sales. I have no system for prices. I have been doing this for over 30 years and I go by feel. I am worth $100 an hour but will never get that so gave up on that   

[stevan]

you may even be able to pick up my radio show without the iHeart radio app..... KCJB 910 AM

Hey Dave, I don't mean to sidetrack your thread but what is your radio show about?

[DWSUDEKUM]

A lot is going to depend upon your area, your economics in the area and the venue of the show that you are attending.  Shows like the church craft fairs and other of that range the potential customer is looking for deals.  If you are attending a juried show you can go a bit higher and if you are attending a top level trade show or Art show then you can command your top dollar.   Thing is what is your time worth.  For me my time is worth a lot but I do a lot of craft fairs and venues of that nature so I can not charge $15 / hr.  So imagine this scenario if you will:  

 

You purchased your vendor spot at the festival for $35 per day and it is a 2 day event so you have $70 tied up for the vendors spot.  Now this is a midlevel event and people will be willing to shell out a couple of extra dollars but they are still looking for a bargain.

 

You figure your time is worth around $15/ hour generally.  So lets assume that you have a Carole Rothman type bowl that you want to sell there.  This bowl is cherry and black walnut and is around 10" in diameter and 4" high.  From start to finish totalling up all the steps from layout to glue up and sanding and finishing you have around 8 Hrs total tied up, not an unreasonable time period especially with all the sanding and prep work for the finish. 8 x $15 / hr = $120 now this does not include the cost of the materials and finishes used.  While in some of the top of the line venues you can command that kind of price for a handcrafted wooden bowl at a mid level even and below folks will admire the work give you complements and back off when they see the price.  For most of my shows I use a simple formula and that is : 2 x cost of materials + $10 + 10%.  So of the materials of the bowl cost me say $15 total then applying the formula 2 x $15= $30 + $10 = $40 + $4= $44 for the bowl.  This will sell fairly well at the mid level markets where the higher price of $120+ will most likely not.  It is EXTREMELY difficult to make enough to live on by selling your wares in most markets.  One of the things to remember is at the craft fairs and show in that range your potential customer will easily reach for a $20 think about that purchase in the $40 range and walk away over $50.  Now there is another unsaid rule that you have to remember.  YOU are the manufacturer and YOU set the price so if you want a sale and they are on the fence about it you can always adjust the price so that you can get the sale.  That said there is one final observation that I will pass on to you.  It takes 3 - 4 years of doing the same shows and talking to folks to get a following and through word of mouth your sales will tend to increase each year and folks will seek you out because they remember something that they saw and liked from before.  Hope this helps a bit.  Good luck on your shows.

 

DW

[MTCowpoke22]

I'll have to see if I can get 910 here. I'm an hour Northwest of Williston.

Edited March 16, 2017 by MTCowpoke22

[David Lehner]

Hey Dave, I don't mean to sidetrack your thread but what is your radio show about?

 

KCJB 910AM   is a Country / Talk / Sports Station...

My shift is 6 - 9 am every morning Monday - Saturday (I take Sunday Off)

My shift is news - weather - community events and Country Music

I program my music selections as the show airs... the more I talk the more changes to the music as show progresses.

 

If you have the iHeart radio app should be no problem to find us --- I have listeners all over the world at times  - Australia to Great Britain to Sweden to Egypt

[David Lehner]

I'll have to see if I can get 910 here. I'm an hour Northwest of Williston.

I have listeners in Plentywood that call on my Saturday morning Swap Shop show --- (if you have something to buy, sell or trade give me a call at 852-1818)

[David Lehner]

A lot is going to depend upon your area, your economics in the area and the venue of the show that you are attending.  Shows like the church craft fairs and other of that range the potential customer is looking for deals.  If you are attending a juried show you can go a bit higher and if you are attending a top level trade show or Art show then you can command your top dollar.   Thing is what is your time worth.  For me my time is worth a lot but I do a lot of craft fairs and venues of that nature so I can not charge $15 / hr.  So imagine this scenario if you will:  

 

You purchased your vendor spot at the festival for $35 per day and it is a 2 day event so you have $70 tied up for the vendors spot.  Now this is a midlevel event and people will be willing to shell out a couple of extra dollars but they are still looking for a bargain.

 

You figure your time is worth around $15/ hour generally.  So lets assume that you have a Carole Rothman type bowl that you want to sell there.  This bowl is cherry and black walnut and is around 10" in diameter and 4" high.  From start to finish totalling up all the steps from layout to glue up and sanding and finishing you have around 8 Hrs total tied up, not an unreasonable time period especially with all the sanding and prep work for the finish. 8 x $15 / hr = $120 now this does not include the cost of the materials and finishes used.  While in some of the top of the line venues you can command that kind of price for a handcrafted wooden bowl at a mid level even and below folks will admire the work give you complements and back off when they see the price.  For most of my shows I use a simple formula and that is : 2 x cost of materials + $10 + 10%.  So of the materials of the bowl cost me say $15 total then applying the formula 2 x $15= $30 + $10 = $40 + $4= $44 for the bowl.  This will sell fairly well at the mid level markets where the higher price of $120+ will most likely not.  It is EXTREMELY difficult to make enough to live on by selling your wares in most markets.  One of the things to remember is at the craft fairs and show in that range your potential customer will easily reach for a $20 think about that purchase in the $40 range and walk away over $50.  Now there is another unsaid rule that you have to remember.  YOU are the manufacturer and YOU set the price so if you want a sale and they are on the fence about it you can always adjust the price so that you can get the sale.  That said there is one final observation that I will pass on to you.  It takes 3 - 4 years of doing the same shows and talking to folks to get a following and through word of mouth your sales will tend to increase each year and folks will seek you out because they remember something that they saw and liked from before.  Hope this helps a bit.  Good luck on your shows.

 

DW

 

Well stated ..... and you are correct ... it does take repetition - doing the show for a few years so people remember you ...

[hawkeye10]

I've just started going to shows, and generally, do the same thing you do as far as calculating time and materials. I'm probably the closest "SS Village" member to you, and agree that there really isn't a market here for our types of products. Of the very few shows I've been to, I'm definitely the only scroller, and usually the only woodworker in the building. I'm doing more and more stack cutting to try to bring down my prices as it seems people are only going to pay so much pretty wall hangings over here. I've been told that I'm just using one of those fancy laser machines, and therefore shouldn't be charging so much. Eyebrows go up when I explain that every piece is hand cut on a saw.

I will help you do some work and you won't be getting those comments.  

[DWSUDEKUM]

I will help you do some work and you won't be getting those comments.  

One of the things I have done in the past to help explain how we make our wares is to make a board that has the different saw blade sizes on it along with a picture of a scroll saw.  I have also brought with me several time some of my work in progress so that they can see just what is involved in making that piece that they though was laser carved.  Once I show them that I thank them for the complement on my skills in cutting as good as a machine can make with a laser.  All in all talking to the customer and showing them things like this will get you remembered for years to come.

 

DW

[JTTHECLOCKMAN]

Some people set up videos on there devices that show them in action and keep it running on a loop while the show is going on. Some people can bring a saw to the show and actually do some cutting and that really gets attention. Not many shows you can do this at but something to think about.

[Jim Finn]

I have been making and selling my stuff for almost ten years now and I have learned that it is difficult to sell anything that costs much over $30.  As has been said, if you need more than $30 to make your product, do not make it.  I look at it this way:  If I was the buyer, how much would I pay for this? This $30 limit may be a little higher in your area.  It is not, here in west Texas.

[dgman]

Formulas don't work for me. I do like Jim above, what would I pay if I were buying. I know that I will never get what I deserve, but I will alway make money on what I make.

I only do two shows a year, but I have been doing them both for four or five years now. I do have some regular customer who look forward to seing what new items I have.

I like to have a wide assortment of different items instead of just one or two types. I usually have clocks, stand up puzzles, wall plaques, desk plaques, Chritsmas ornaments, mini bird houses, Nativity scenes, compound cut items and so on. I usually try to have something for everyone, but I don't make children's toys. I used to belong to a very large WW club. There were several members who made and sold toys, so I didn't want to compete with them.

I use mainly hard woods on all my items and never use stains or paint. I always use a 50/50 mix of boiled linseed oil and mineral spirits to bring out the color and grain of the woods. Then a topcoat of semigloss Laqcuer.

I do use Baltic Birch for portraits and as backer boards.

I too get the "is that done with a laser?" Thing. I always explain that the edges would be burnt if it was done with a laser. I also have a picture handy of me sawing away on my saw.

I mention using hardwoods because It makes for better looking projects than using pine or Baltic Birch. All my ornaments are made of hardwoods, not BB as I feel it makes for a better looking product. I sell hundreds of ornament a year!

[amazingkevin]

I would be surprised if this has not been discussed in the past … but here it is

 

Does anyone have a formula or method they use for pricing their work when doing a craft show.  I know that the market will dictate to a degree. When I do shows in this area there are maybe one or two other scrollers there also. We all do different types of work. One does mainly religious things, another only Christmas ornaments. I have a whole series of framed prairie scenes, wildlife scenes, scroll clocks of many different styles and sizes…. I also have seasonal items … My Christmas ornaments and decorations are mainly 3D.

On all framed and matted pictures I leave the glass off (if the frame includes glass) as it reduces the weight and people don’t realize the picture is cut out of wood (ususally 1/8 baltic birch for me) unless they can touch it to see it’s not a print.

 

So I have no "market" in my area to compare to.....

 

My rule of thumb is to figure about $10.00 per hour for the cutting time, finishing and framing. . Intricate pieces I figure more per hour for cutting.Then add the price of wood, backing, frame etc. I do stack cut so if  a project takes a longer time to cut it gets pro-rated by the number I create.

 

I also have a “do it yourself†kit. Sometimes I have been told that what I do does not seem that difficult. I offer them the “do it yourself†kit for a fraction of the price. The kit includes a couple blades, a pattern and a piece of wood.  Framing is extra...

 

I am open to suggestions as most customers do not understand the time and skill set involved.

Yes i agree stack cutting helps get the price down and still make money .

[Fab4]

Hi Dave:

I look at like this

If I can cover the price of the material plus a bit more then I'm ahead of the game

I do not have a "per hour" price for my time spent on the saw

For me this is a hobby, and it is a great fun hobby at that

When it becomes "work" than it's no fun at all

What sells here for $15 will probably not sell there for the same price

or sell at all. 

A lot of great suggestions were given, but know your area and the people in it

then you'll be off to a great start

Good Luck and keep it fun

Fab4

[hawkeye10]

Formulas don't work for me. I do like Jim above, what would I pay if I were buying. I know that I will never get what I deserve, but I will alway make money on what I make.

I only do two shows a year, but I have been doing them both for four or five years now. I do have some regular customer who look forward to seing what new items I have.

I like to have a wide assortment of different items instead of just one or two types. I usually have clocks, stand up puzzles, wall plaques, desk plaques, Chritsmas ornaments, mini bird houses, Nativity scenes, compound cut items and so on. I usually try to have something for everyone, but I don't make children's toys. I used to belong to a very large WW club. There were several members who made and sold toys, so I didn't want to compete with them.

I use mainly hard woods on all my items and never use stains or paint. I always use a 50/50 mix of boiled linseed oil and mineral spirits to bring out the color and grain of the woods. Then a topcoat of semigloss Laqcuer.

I do use Baltic Birch for portraits and as backer boards.

I too get the "is that done with a laser?" Thing. I always explain that the edges would be burnt if it was done with a laser. I also have a picture handy of me sawing away on my saw.

I mention using hardwoods because It makes for better looking projects than using pine or Baltic Birch. All my ornaments are made of hardwoods, not BB as I feel it makes for a better looking product. I sell hundreds of ornament a year!

That is awesome Dan.  

[Casey Jourdan]

Hi Dave:

I look at like this

If I can cover the price of the material plus a bit more then I'm ahead of the game

I do not have a "per hour" price for my time spent on the saw

For me this is a hobby, and it is a great fun hobby at that

When it becomes "work" than it's no fun at all

What sells here for $15 will probably not sell there for the same price

or sell at all. 

A lot of great suggestions were given, but know your area and the people in it

then you'll be off to a great start

Good Luck and keep it fun

Fab4

  

I'm with you Fab4, I don't worry so much about my time because this is just a hobby for me. I focus on covering cost of materials and a few extra bucks on top of that. I'm happy when the hobby pays for its self.