Popular Post jimmyG Posted March 7 Popular Post Report Share Posted March 7 I won't admit how long it took or how much wood was wasted... I won't show what the back looks like either. But it is what it is and ready for some paint. I have a lot to learn about routing the groove for the glass and project and not sure if I have the patience (or ability) to try any miter joints. All of the Youtube videos were either without instruction, just showing off their skills or explaining the details like an engineer. Scrappile, barb.j.enders, Charlie E and 14 others 17 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scrappile Posted March 7 Report Share Posted March 7 certainly nothing wrong with that.. I am still intimated by frames. What are the best clamps to glue them with. I keep looking. jimmyG and danny 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rjweb Posted March 7 Report Share Posted March 7 Very nice job, RJ jimmyG 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimmyG Posted March 7 Author Report Share Posted March 7 1 hour ago, Scrappile said: certainly nothing wrong with that.. I am still intimated by frames. What are the best clamps to glue them with. I keep looking. I just used 2 Jorgenson F style clamps. For mitered corners I tried to use the fancy ass Bessey strap clamp a few times and ended up throwing it across the shop. I had to experiment and see what happens. Even though mistakes were made it's how to learn. I have a neighbor who owns a glass shop and he cut glass for 7 project's n/c so that was a huge favor. There's so much time between router table uses I had to be careful and take my time anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jerry walters Posted March 8 Report Share Posted March 8 Jimmy, your frame looks good to me. I recently did a project that requires a frame. Going to frame shop was expensive. Found a ready made frame the fit my project perfectly, but really flimsy. Like you, if found instructions very frustrating, didn't teach me a thing. Also youtube instructions for most things are primarily just showing off their abilities and equipment they have. My shop is very simple and tools I have are very limited, just basic tools for scrolling. I will keep trying. Jerry jimmyG and danny 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimmyG Posted March 8 Author Report Share Posted March 8 8 hours ago, jerry walters said: Jimmy, your frame looks good to me. I recently did a project that requires a frame. Going to frame shop was expensive. Found a ready made frame the fit my project perfectly, but really flimsy. Like you, if found instructions very frustrating, didn't teach me a thing. Also youtube instructions for most things are primarily just showing off their abilities and equipment they have. My shop is very simple and tools I have are very limited, just basic tools for scrolling. I will keep trying. Jerry I guess the only way to learn how to properly make a frame is to work in a frame shop as an apprentice. Most veteran woodworker/makers on Youtube don't make good teachers. I'm sure plenty of mistakes are made but we don't get to see then. I have a pretty well stocked workshop but my problem is I want to try and make everything. Scrolling is what I like to do best but its frustrating trying to learn how to get those finishing touches accomplished (framing) Gotta keep moving forward.... It's funny I do recall flunking wood shop in school RabidAlien 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RabidAlien Posted March 8 Report Share Posted March 8 Gave up on my router table, I use a table saw and a miter saw to make frames. I figure out how deep the groove needs to be, and how much overlap of the project, and I set my tablesaw fence and blade height accordingly. To make things easy on myself, I try to give myself enough room to overlap the project by the same length as the project and backer are thick. That way, I set the blade and the fence once. I'll get my frame stock, usually a ripped-down 2x4 or those trash spacers they use between layers of fencing slats at the big box stores (Lowes just throws those away, and welcomes any assistance in getting rid of them....sanded and stained a dark color, they look amazing). I'll run the frame stock down the table saw, then flip and rotate and run it down again to cut out a rectangular chunk. If the two cuts overlap a bit, that's fine, all of the over-cut will be inside the frame. Once I have my frame stock with a square cut out of one side, I set my miter to 45 degrees, and start cutting the sides. I usually use the project/backer to mark a side, cut the next angle, then measure again and mark each piece for top/bottom/left/right. I'll sand the frame, round the edges a bit with an oscillating hand sander, then I glue and nailgun the pieces together. Nothing fancy, just leaning on the piece to keep my body parts out of the way of any errant nails (had one go through my thumbnail.....never again. That hurt.). The nails are mainly there to hold it together while the glue sets. Frame assembled, I'll test for fit, sand the project/backer if I was a little off or there was some warping in the frame that I didn't notice. I measure and center a hanger on the back of the frame, stain it, and let it sit for 24 hours or so, then run a bead of wood glue around the inside corner, drop the project in, flip it right-side up and wipe up any glue that squeezed out. Let dry, and hang up! Your frame looks awesome, nobody's going to be taking it down to critique the back anyway. jimmyG 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill WIlson Posted March 8 Report Share Posted March 8 14 hours ago, Scrappile said: certainly nothing wrong with that.. I am still intimated by frames. What are the best clamps to glue them with. I keep looking. I won't say they are the best, but I have one like this and it has worked well for me. jimmyG 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimmyG Posted March 8 Author Report Share Posted March 8 16 minutes ago, RabidAlien said: Gave up on my router table, I use a table saw and a miter saw to make frames. I figure out how deep the groove needs to be, and how much overlap of the project, and I set my tablesaw fence and blade height accordingly. To make things easy on myself, I try to give myself enough room to overlap the project by the same length as the project and backer are thick. That way, I set the blade and the fence once. I'll get my frame stock, usually a ripped-down 2x4 or those trash spacers they use between layers of fencing slats at the big box stores (Lowes just throws those away, and welcomes any assistance in getting rid of them....sanded and stained a dark color, they look amazing). I'll run the frame stock down the table saw, then flip and rotate and run it down again to cut out a rectangular chunk. If the two cuts overlap a bit, that's fine, all of the over-cut will be inside the frame. Once I have my frame stock with a square cut out of one side, I set my miter to 45 degrees, and start cutting the sides. I usually use the project/backer to mark a side, cut the next angle, then measure again and mark each piece for top/bottom/left/right. I'll sand the frame, round the edges a bit with an oscillating hand sander, then I glue and nailgun the pieces together. Nothing fancy, just leaning on the piece to keep my body parts out of the way of any errant nails (had one go through my thumbnail.....never again. That hurt.). The nails are mainly there to hold it together while the glue sets. Frame assembled, I'll test for fit, sand the project/backer if I was a little off or there was some warping in the frame that I didn't notice. I measure and center a hanger on the back of the frame, stain it, and let it sit for 24 hours or so, then run a bead of wood glue around the inside corner, drop the project in, flip it right-side up and wipe up any glue that squeezed out. Let dry, and hang up! Your frame looks awesome, nobody's going to be taking it down to critique the back anyway. Yeah, the router table is a bit of a challenge for me to use because I don't hardly use it and I'm not that comfortable having my fingers close to a meat slicer... I thought it would have been easier using butt joints but I was wrong. Top and bottom pieces were routed all the way through but the sides couldn't be because the ends would show the rabbet. Slowly easing the 1x2 into the bit to start about an inch in was a little scary and twice I made the mistake of moving right and it cut a chunk from the end. If I was better with miters I wouldn't have "that" problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barb.j.enders Posted March 8 Report Share Posted March 8 Good looking frame. I am also intimidated with making frames. I don't have a table saw, jointer, etc etc. I have a scroll saw! You-Tube sucks at instructions for making frames. That being said, I have found one that I have been using. I just recently purchased a mini table saw to get the 45 degree angles. jimmyG and danny 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daveww1 Posted March 8 Report Share Posted March 8 very nice frame jimmyG 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Denny Knappen Posted March 8 Report Share Posted March 8 As a custom framer, you did a great job. Easy if opposite sides are exactly the same and the miters are 45 degrees. jimmyG and Wichman 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wichman Posted March 8 Report Share Posted March 8 I worked in a commercial framing shop for 26 years. There are so many things that can go sideways in a miter joint. After being used to using very expensive commercial machines I have zero interest in trying to use DIY machines to make frames. Your frame looks very well made. Kudos. jimmyG 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimmyG Posted March 8 Author Report Share Posted March 8 2 hours ago, Wichman said: I worked in a commercial framing shop for 26 years. There are so many things that can go sideways in a miter joint. After being used to using very expensive commercial machines I have zero interest in trying to use DIY machines to make frames. Your frame looks very well made. Kudos. Glad to get that feedback, thought it was just me. YouTube's videos make it look easy and some do use fancy jigs and equipment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wichman Posted March 8 Report Share Posted March 8 16 minutes ago, jimmyG said: Glad to get that feedback, thought it was just me. YouTube's videos make it look easy and some do use fancy jigs and equipment. $10,000 double chop saw ( x 2 one is 3 phase) $10,000 v-nailer ( x 2) $50,000 computerized mat cutter. Ain't cheap to get started anymore. You could probably get by with much less with a small custom shop, but I cut over a million mats with that mat cutter ( Gunnar 1001 ) somehow they managed to kill it a year after I left. To avoid a mess or taking time to walk to the trash can to throw away a blade (x-acto #13 size ), I set a 5 gallon bucket at the foot of my workstation for the mat cutter; I filled the bucket. jimmyG 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dak0ta52 Posted March 8 Report Share Posted March 8 Looks like an outstanding job to me. I have set up a miter cut to do frames on my table saw. I first route the grove, cut the 45 angle with a jig, glue the frame, cut spline groves with another jig, then insert the glue and splines. jimmyG 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heppnerguy Posted March 9 Report Share Posted March 9 I am starting to get into making my frames and I have learned to make my own inlays but have not put one together yet, my next frame I will include an inlaid frame. As far as making a frame It depends on what wood thickness you cut your pattern from. For 1/4 ply I start by cutting all the wood for it on my table saw to make sure they are all the exact width and thickness. Next I use my router to cut the groove in for my project on all my frame wood. If I am going to round my edges I route all of them. If I decide I want to have a 45 degree on the inside of the frame I route that next. Then I go to the miter saw and cut my length so they are exactly the same. Because I am new to making my frames, I then lay the first two pieces upside down and check to see if my project I am framing is the precise length I need. I always cut them a little too long on purpose so I have enough for this step. I inside of the the grove where the plaque is going to be inset is where I determine the length needed. I usually allow about a 16th inch total length longer as that will still hold my insert pattern without a problem. I do the same one the other two sides and when I am happy with that, I glue them up. That is they process I use and it seems to work for me Dick heppnerguy jimmyG 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie E Posted March 9 Report Share Posted March 9 Nice looking piece. For a piece like that I actually like the look of a non-mitered frame. Bit more rustic, which I like. I've got around 140 portraits on my shop walls and not a frame on one of them, so you know how much I enjoy making frames. jimmyG 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimmyG Posted March 9 Author Report Share Posted March 9 3 hours ago, Charlie E said: Nice looking piece. For a piece like that I actually like the look of a non-mitered frame. Bit more rustic, which I like. I've got around 140 portraits on my shop walls and not a frame on one of them, so you know how much I enjoy making frames. I actually like the butt joints better than a miter. It's a trade off on the construction though since you can only cut the rabet all the way through on 2 pieces so it won't be seen on the outside edges. For me it was tricky to start those non through cuts easing the wood into a spinning but at the right spot, not too short or long. I made that first frame partly because that 1/4" Baltic birch panel was starting to warp which is possible when so much material is removed on some projects. I'm retired just wanting to kill some time, learn something, stay out of the wife's way and have all my fingers at the end of the day. Charlie E 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimmyG Posted March 9 Author Report Share Posted March 9 (edited) So for what it's worth, I'm going to call it finished... Although I have glass already cut for my other six projects, and used it on this one, I may not use it with all of them since the reflections are a distraction and it really doesn't do the cutting any justice. I think miter joints on frames have their place on certain subject matter but I really like the look of butt joints more. Though the more I look at it I think the 2 inch frame width makes it look chunky, maybe 1 inch instead?? Let the experimenting begin! Edited March 9 by jimmyG Added another comment about width... barb.j.enders 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keefie Posted March 9 Report Share Posted March 9 Very nice frame, nice tight joints. Picture is nice too jimmyG 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roberta Moreton Posted March 10 Report Share Posted March 10 I have made frames. Now, I just buy them at the craft store during a sale. Frame, mat, and glass or just frame and glass jimmyG 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BadBob Posted March 11 Report Share Posted March 11 I haven't made a frame in years, but when I did, splined miters were my favorite. There is nothing wrong with a half lap or but joint for a frame. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FrankEV Posted March 16 Report Share Posted March 16 This post got me thinking. I have been a advocate of using a frame to complete an Art panel project. Frames can be either readily available commercial frames (such as those available from Walmart, Hobby Lobby, etc.) or custom made, like I do for all of my recent work. The big advantages to custom made are: lower cost to make than buy, and panel size is not of concern as a custom frame can be any size. Frame construction can be very basic or very ornate and complecated. Equipment to make custom "profesional" quality frames is very expensive and not suitable for the common hobby type shops most of us operate. Also, most Scroll Saw Art panels celebrate the wood we use to create the art and overly ornate frames are not often suitable. Therefore, I find the frames for my work need only be simple flat frames similar to the many quality commercial frames on the market at rediculous prices. I my case, as I produce a lot of Art Panels, it is absolutely necessary to keep the cost of framing my work to a minimum. I have developed a method to make, in my opinion, reasonably nice simple flat frames that celebrate the Art panel while keeping the cost per frame to a minimum. I have posted a short tutorial in the Learning Center in Works in Progress & Tutorials that show the step by step method I use to make my frames. Wichman, barb.j.enders and jimmyG 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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